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-   -   Big changes to county cricket in the pipeline (http://www.cricket247.org/community/showthread.php?t=19332)

paulsre 19th May 2015 16:18

Big changes to county cricket in the pipeline
 
http://www.espncricinfo.com/england/...ry/878297.html

Good (IMHO):

- no t20 franchise
- 50 over competition earlier in the season
- maybe an expanded Championship with 3 divisions of 7

Bad:

Expanded championship with 3 divsions of 7 means just 12 Championship games per side per season.

Aidan11 19th May 2015 16:43

Why don't they just scrap the County Championship?

It gets in the way of their precious T20 so let the babies have their bottle and watch English cricket die on its f***ing arse.

Comte Nom de Plume 19th May 2015 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aidan11 (Post 669496)
Why don't they just scrap the County Championship?

It gets in the way of their precious T20 so let the babies have their bottle and watch English cricket die on its f***ing arse.

I very much doubt that the site moderators would allow the language I would like to use.
English cricket will be screwed beyond belief.
Too angry to say more at this stage.

paulsre 19th May 2015 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDogg16 (Post 669500)
Interesting article. I'm not a really a fan of having associate members play in county cricket. I never liked it when Ireland and the Netherlands played in the one day competitions.

One format that hasn't been muted would be two divisions of twelve team, with each team facing each other once. This would mean plucking six teams from minor counties cricket, who would go into the second division, and the top twelve teams in the top division.

The format would be crucial. I don't have time to reply now but would be interested to hear people's thoughts.

CDogg16 19th May 2015 17:28

The best thing about it is there will be no franchises.

For me, Test cricket is the pinnacle of international cricket and the County Championship is the pinnacle of English cricket, so reducing the amount of games would be disappointing.

In the other thread I mentioned having two divisions of twelve teams with each playing each other once. This would include picking six counties from minor counties, with the top two going up and the bottom two going down. At the end of the season, you could also have the top four team playing each other to decide the championship, similar to Super league in rugby league.

These three matches (two semis and a final) would be the climax of the season. In order to ensure a result you could make the games five days in length. This way although you would be losing games it would be exciting playing more teams and having the end of season drama.

Hector 19th May 2015 18:16

Interesting points about 3 more teams in the CC. Would be interesting to see if it would be 3 of the minor counties (and if that was the case which 3) or whether Scotland and / or Ireland would be included.

I'm not in the camp of believing that this is the cricket apocalypse / heresy. Whether people like it or not Cricket is now a three format sport and the ECB should be looking to create a schedule so that England are competitive in all 3 formats.

Summer of '77 19th May 2015 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tongo (Post 669509)
Interesting points about 3 more teams in the CC. Would be interesting to see if it would be 3 of the minor counties (and if that was the case which 3) or whether Scotland and / or Ireland would be included.

I'm not in the camp of believing that this is the cricket apocalypse / heresy. Whether people like it or not Cricket is now a three format sport and the ECB should be looking to create a schedule so that England are competitive in all 3 formats.


During the last WC, there were relentless comments about how the games were being played in a T20 fashion, with the big achievers in the tournament being T20 specialists who has gained plentiful experience in the IPL/Big Bash. In which case, why even bother with a domestic 50 over tournament in England, seeing as there's only me and about 43 other people who actually like the thing? Scrap it and create more room for T20, more income from T20 (rather than a money-leaking 50 overs job), and the Championship can be left alone.

Ali TT 19th May 2015 19:02

A desire to increase interest in the limited overs game before the next world cup?

Here's an idea, get some games on free-to-air telly! Or at least show every t20 game live on Sky.

Here's some points...
Every IPL/big bash match is shown live on TV
I can watch live or highlights of every domestic, European or international football game, plus loads from European leagues
Rugby the same
I can watch obscure golf, tennis, snooker or darts tournaments live on tv
Every baseball game in the US is shown live on TV or Internet somewhere. They play 162 games per team per season

County cricket on TV? Maybe 1-2 4 day games per year and what, less than 1/4 of all limited over games? No wonder it's a dying game

paulsre 20th May 2015 08:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tongo (Post 669509)
I'm not in the camp of believing that this is the cricket apocalypse / heresy. Whether people like it or not Cricket is now a three format sport and the ECB should be looking to create a schedule so that England are competitive in all 3 formats.

A very sensible post.

If I am right, there's more days of Championship cricket per side scheduled now (64) than 40 years ago, when clubs played 20 three day matches (60).

The most straightforward way to reduce the games to 12 within the existing structure would be that teams play 4 sides twice and 4 sides once. I know this had people up in arms under the Morgan Review, but wasn't that how Championship cricket was organised for many years (playing some teams twice and some once)?

Without wholly wanting to come across as devil's advocate, I wonder just how many people who follow one club actually attend a full 32 days of a club's home Championship matches.

Sir Virgs and Zamora 20th May 2015 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulsre (Post 669549)
A very sensible post.

If I am right, there's more days of Championship cricket per side scheduled now (64) than 40 years ago, when clubs played 20 three day matches (60).

The most straightforward way to reduce the games to 12 within the existing structure would be that teams play 4 sides twice and 4 sides once. I know this had people up in arms under the Morgan Review, but wasn't that how Championship cricket was organised for many years (playing some teams twice and some once)?

Without wholly wanting to come across as devil's advocate, I wonder just how many people who follow one club actually attend a full 32 days of a club's home Championship matches.

Very few Attend all of the days but it is not that easy. If you only have 6 games and they are early and late in the season then your viewing could be limited.

My favourite day at cricket for ages was last year at Taunton on a June day watching us play Sussex. Moving champo matches out of high summer is a poor idea.

During the World Cup there were complaints about us not having players who could score 400 because we play on green pitches. Imagine the quality of test bowler we would produce if they played all of their first class cricket in April, May and sept.

I love that we won yesterday, but that wicket at Trent bridge won't help create test quality bowlers. If we shortened the champo then there would be a greater need for result pitches -especially if we played in the wettest months.

This brings me back to the golden goose. More t20 will not bring more fans unless it is free to air. Cutting champ matches is not the answer. I hope that more pros support Kerrigan who has come out against it.

Work time.

Aidan11 20th May 2015 10:55

I suspect that when the CC does become reduced that the Membership subs wont reduce accordingly.

There are quite a few members around who only attend the first class stuff.

paulsre 20th May 2015 12:10

At the heart of the problem is that English cricket is an administrative nightmare. I can't think of any other sports that suffer from issues such as clubs' fans only wanting to attend certain competitions. Then you have an international game that is so dominant, and an irony that its most sellable form - 50 overs - is now the least popular in the county game. Finally that club/league cricket, which used to attract decent crowd numbers in some regions, has seen a collapse in interest as a spectator sport.

And of course you have a limited window in the year in which to play, which has already been stretched to its limit.

Thus whatever changes are made, they are almost bound to be received negatively in some quarters.

Sir Virgs and Zamora 20th May 2015 12:24

Re supporters rejecting other competitions. Fa cup and league cup crowds are terrible. Man U had to threaten season ticket holders with a ban if they did not buy fa cup tickets.

Summer of '77 20th May 2015 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Virgs and Zamora (Post 669560)
Re supporters rejecting other competitions. Fa cup and league cup crowds are terrible. Man U had to threaten season ticket holders with a ban if they did not buy fa cup tickets.

Some fans at West Ham are crying out for their players to go in hard and get booked, to avoid getting the 'fair play' entry into the Europa League!

Sir Virgs and Zamora 20th May 2015 12:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Summer of '77 (Post 669561)
Some fans at West Ham are crying out for their players to go in hard and get booked, to avoid getting the 'fair play' entry into the Europa League!

The lower leagues have the paint trophy or windscreens cup or whatever it is too.

paulsre 20th May 2015 12:59

Yeah, ok, so there are those issues in football too but the main point still stands.

Summer of '77 20th May 2015 13:07

With the English cricket competitions, I get the feeling that the 50 overs thing is almost nobody's favourite. It's like that scene in Auf Wiedersehen Pet when they're voting on a colour for the hut decor and and up with yellow - "Who voted for yellow?" "Nobody, but it's everyone's second preference". Last year, I found myself in a sizeable camp of CC fans who went along to the Royal London because it's a full day's cricket...but we'd all much prefer to be watching the red ball game. Similarly, I identified a decent smattering of T20 fans who were there to catch some limited overs thrills and spills, but would have rather it over was the shorter format.

It's certainly not a lucrative competition, in the way the old Gillette and B&H once were. Because Warks were desperate to fill some seats for their semi final with Kent, they allowed members of both counties in for free and charged everyone else a tenner. Kent's share of the meagre gate income was so small, they barely covered their expenses for the day.

The only rationale for retaining a non-T20 limited overs competition has to that it unequivocally helps to prepare the national side for its ODI commitments. Most of the chatter from WC2015, however, seemed to suggest that England are still entrenched in a mid-90s mindset and that, in fact, it's T20 which is better equipping cricketers to excel over 50 overs. I believe this point needs to be thoroughly considered, because if the 50 overs competition is failing in its preparatory duties, attracting nobody and is a financial flop, then why on earth should we be contemplating reducing the Championship rather than doing the truly radical thing and admitting that old-school domestic one-dayers are redundant?

paulsre 20th May 2015 13:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Summer of '77 (Post 669568)

I believe this point needs to be thoroughly considered, because if the 50 overs competition is failing in its preparatory duties, attracting nobody and is a financial flop, then why on earth should we be contemplating reducing the Championship rather than doing the truly radical thing and admitting that old-school domestic one-dayers are redundant?

Unfortunately though there is no way the ECB will completely abandon playing 50 over domestic cricket.

But if you look at the existing competition it is actually already stripped to the bone. The 10 clubs that don't make it to the quarter-finals are playing just 8 days - and hosting a mere 4 - of 50 overs cricket a year.

The problem is that those days currently occupy the absolute prime spot in the cricketing calendar - late July to late August. The games are spread out, most notably with the quarter-finals, that occupy almost an entire week in order to maximise TV coverage.

Summer of '77 20th May 2015 13:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulsre (Post 669569)
Unfortunately though there is no way the ECB will completely abandon playing 50 over domestic cricket.

Aye, I know. And, from my own purely personal cricket-watching perspective, I'm quite happy with that.

But this is why I scoffed when hearing talk a few months ago of the proposed "radical shake up of English Cricket". It'll be just another load of tinkering and readjusting. Trimming the County Championship is about as radical as the Chancellor sticking 10p on a packet of tabs.

oldandfat 20th May 2015 14:06

Simple economics mean an expended Championship with more sides will never happen - Counties rely on handouts from the International game (I am not saying this is a bad thing) to keep going, agreeing to spread these thinner is akin to "turkeys voting for Christmas".
Yes more cricket on TV (both free to air and SKY) would be a good thing - I like the idea of "Friday night is cricket night". Do we know why so little CC is shown on SKY? The 50 (or 40) over game should be played Saturday/Sundays - I would advocate of playing it alongside the CC fixture (so Div 1 CC play each other in the 50 over) with semis (top Div 1 v's 2nd in Div 2) and finals. Ideally with free entry to all group games and aired on free to view (Sky have channels of freeview) the site of full grounds would do wonders!


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