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Old 20th September 2017, 13:20   #81
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Originally Posted by Notts Exile View Post
He's in because he's a left armer, that's it surely? He offers little if the ball doesn't swing and isn't trusted to bowl at the end much.

He doesn't strike me as being much better than Harry Gurney. Obviously he can bat an field which is an improvement though.
He does take a few wickets with the new ball because he can usually get it to swing but he is a bit of a passenger after that. His batting is decent enough at county level but he seems to struggle a bit at a higher (not that he's had a lot of opportunities).
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Old 20th September 2017, 13:29   #82
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They haven't taken the gloves off him in the ODI team. He isn't the incumbent and with a motto of 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' they're not going to take the gloves off Jos unless he starts to really screw up. Same with YJB in the Test Team, you can't take the gloves off him because a batsman up the order keeps failing. If you do you risk both positions. There's no guarantee the person you bring in as wk/bat would perform and there's no guarantee that YJB will perform either without the gloves. He's driven to do what his goals are, and if I know him as far as the ODI team is concerned his first goal is getting established in the team, his second will be to have eyes on it as a wk/bat, which, let's face it in 50 over he could do at opener. But that depends on how Jos performs so it won't be soon, if ever!
The thing is the test team is broken, certainly the top 5. Even if Bairstow's returns don't improve and he continues to average about 40 it would be an overall improvement on the likes of Tom Westley (average 24), Dawid Malan (23), James Vince (19) and Gary Ballance (19 since the start of the 2015 season). Of course there are no guarantees but I would back YJB to improve on his current average and I would back Foakes to average around 30 in the short to medium term batting at 8.
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Old 20th September 2017, 13:33   #83
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They need to do something about the building that looks like a big, red fan heater...
Maybe they should hire the designer of "The Carbuncle" (aka the Carnegie Pavilion) for advice?
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Old 20th September 2017, 13:40   #84
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I was a bit surprised to see Willey get the nod ahead of Ball and Curran yesterday. I suspect he might be left out sooner rather than later. He is a good fielder but his batting appears to offer little value in international cricket.
I'm not surprised considering that they're still persisting with Jordan in T20.

Neither seem to be international standard bowlers to me and their batting reputation far outstrips their batting returns in international cricket.

I see all of Plunkett, T. Curran, Wood, Topley, Mills, Bopara, Woakes, Finn, Ball, TRJ as superior options for the three bowling spots they are competing for in ODI/T20Is (and I appreciate some of those aren't suited to play both those formats and/or are injured).

One other word on the bowling front, really disappointed with Ben Stokes. He needs to be better than that.
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Old 20th September 2017, 13:43   #85
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One other word on the bowling front, really disappointed with Ben Stokes. He needs to be better than that.
The last over you mean? I agree he needs to be better but he bowled superbly up until that point.
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Old 20th September 2017, 13:52   #86
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The thing is the test team is broken, certainly the top 5. Even if Bairstow's returns don't improve and he continues to average about 40 it would be an overall improvement on the likes of Tom Westley (average 24), Dawid Malan (23), James Vince (19) and Gary Ballance (19 since the start of the 2015 season). Of course there are no guarantees but I would back YJB to improve on his current average and I would back Foakes to average around 30 in the short to medium term batting at 8.
England's test top 5 is broken but I'm not sure giving up probably the one area (the lower middle order) England have an edge over Australia is the way to go. I'd far rather try and find other solutions to fixing the top 5 that retain that strong lower middle order.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 20th September 2017, 14:03   #87
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The last over you mean? I agree he needs to be better but he bowled superbly up until that point.
Yep, 4 wides and two no-balls is what you'd expect of Chris Jordan, not a proper international cricketer.

It's so sloppy. I get wides sometimes happen but not at this rate and the no-balls are inexcusable. That's now the last four consecutive ODIs he's topped the most extras conceded by an England bowler (and that includes a match where he only bowled 3.1 overs).

He must do better than that.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 20th September 2017, 14:33   #88
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EVIDENCE taking the gloves off him can work to England's advantage?
I wouldn't say so. In ODIs playing as keeper, Bairstow's batting average is 47.00. In ODIs playing as a specialist batsman, it's 42.69.
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Old 20th September 2017, 14:37   #89
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England's test top 5 is broken but I'm not sure giving up probably the one area (the lower middle order) England have an edge over Australia is the way to go. I'd far rather try and find other solutions to fixing the top 5 that retain that strong lower middle order.
Who would your top 5 be to start the Ashes series?
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Old 20th September 2017, 14:45   #90
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The thing is the test team is broken, certainly the top 5. Even if Bairstow's returns don't improve and he continues to average about 40 it would be an overall improvement on the likes of Tom Westley (average 24), Dawid Malan (23), James Vince (19) and Gary Ballance (19 since the start of the 2015 season). Of course there are no guarantees but I would back YJB to improve on his current average and I would back Foakes to average around 30 in the short to medium term batting at 8.
I think I might have done Foakes' batting a disservice; I've just checked and he averages 42.56 in first class cricket, higher than Stoneman (35.07), Jennings (34.64), Hameed (37.98), Westley (36.92), Malan (37.51) and Vince (39.08). Maybe he should bat at 5?
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Old 20th September 2017, 14:51   #91
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Who would your top 5 be to start the Ashes series?
Would depend on the last couple of rounds of county championship (and warm-up games in Oz).

I'm hoping Hameed scores some runs. Would then probably move Stoneman down to 3 and then need a 5 to raise their hand (Westley/Malan/Ballance/Joe Clarke/Lawrence/Northeast/Livingstone/Duckett) with a series of dominant performances. The good news is that I think they pretty much all profile best at 5 or 6.

In the absence of a class act, I'll take the hot hand.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 20th September 2017, 14:53   #92
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Would depend on the last couple of rounds of county championship (and warm-up games in Oz).

I'm hoping Hameed scores some runs. Would then probably move Stoneman down to 3 and then need a 5 to raise their hand (Westley/Malan/Ballance/Joe Clarke/Lawrence/Northeast/Livingstone/Duckett) with a series of dominant performances. The good news is that I think they pretty much all profile best at 5 or 6.

In the absence of a class act, I'll take the hot hand.
Have you ruled out Hales?
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Old 20th September 2017, 15:18   #93
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Have you ruled out Hales?
No, that was just an oversight on my behalf because he's not featuring in this round of championship matches. I'd say he's fairly high up that list as it currently stands.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 20th September 2017, 15:19   #94
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They need to do something about the building that looks like a big, red fan heater, though, and why does the new hotel allow guests to take their beds and sofas outside to watch the cricket.
I don't think it behoves someone whose home ground is dominated by a weirdly shaped green-coloured monstrosity (no wonder Dickie Bird is always sitting in it, he doesn't have to look at it) to criticise the smooth lines of the Old Trafford Point - which if nothing else, proudly bears the colour of the Red Rose.

You may have heard David Lloyd talking about the custom in New Zealand whereby fans take old sofas to the cricket and set fire to them after close of play. I haven't seen such pyrotechnics at Olf Trafford yet but keep watching...
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Old 20th September 2017, 15:23   #95
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EVIDENCE taking the gloves off him can work to England's advantage?
Different format. I'm delighted he made his first ODI 100 but it doesn't actually prove anything re keeping/not keeping.
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Old 20th September 2017, 15:26   #96
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Johnny B is a good player.
But should he be replacing Roy? He builds an innings nicely and takes responsibility, he would be in my team. But probably not as Hales opening partner - a quick 30 at a SR of 150 really sets a tone at the start of an innings and allows Hales to find his feet. The thing that has always impressed me with Roy is that he plays to the needs of the team, he does not try to build slow and steady to bolster his figures, rather he blasts from the start.
Give me a score of 80-100+ over a quick 30 that sets the tone any day.
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Old 20th September 2017, 15:27   #97
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I haven't seen such pyrotechnics at Olf Trafford yet but keep watching...
I wouldn't rule it out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oromo_Liberation_Front
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 20th September 2017, 15:31   #98
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Johnny B is a good player.
But should he be replacing Roy? He builds an innings nicely and takes responsibility, he would be in my team. But probably not as Hales opening partner - a quick 30 at a SR of 150 really sets a tone at the start of an innings and allows Hales to find his feet. The thing that has always impressed me with Roy is that he plays to the needs of the team, he does not try to build slow and steady to bolster his figures, rather he blasts from the start.
Agreed.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 20th September 2017, 17:11   #99
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He does take a few wickets with the new ball because he can usually get it to swing but he is a bit of a passenger after that. His batting is decent enough at county level but he seems to struggle a bit at a higher (not that he's had a lot of opportunities).
He really should be given an opportunity to come in at 3 (if they continue to pick him) if we lose an early wicket, his batting is suited to hitting over the top when the field is up although no-one knows if he's going to be able to do it against international bowlers as he's never been given the chance.

It wasn't an issue yesterday as we were chasing a low total and had an over less of the powerplay but Root often wastes the powerplay overs and is more likely to get out before he can come in to his own in the middle overs which really isn't what you need if we're chasing (or trying to set) a big total.

I'm not a massive fan of the 6 bowlers + root either so wouldn't mind swapping a bowler for Roy or Billings and Willey seems the obvious bowler to drop but who opens the bowling with Woakes then?
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Old 21st September 2017, 11:14   #100
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I don't think it behoves someone whose home ground is dominated by a weirdly shaped green-coloured monstrosity...
Let's face it, we both have some modern architecture at our home grounds to be embarrassed about. I think we only have one example of it, though.

It could be worse. It could be Lords with its Cherie Blair inspired media monstrosity.
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