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Old 18th February 2018, 08:36   #121
Jock McTuffnel v3
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175 = NZ in final. 174 or less it’s England.
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Old 18th February 2018, 08:38   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Virgs and Zamora View Post
This is a funny one for NZ. Do they set out to win the match or lose by 19? Sends all the wrong messages to aim to lose not too badly and could collapse in a heap, but why chase 20 more than needed.
Should imagine they go for it for the power play . 175 is still a few runs.
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Old 18th February 2018, 08:49   #123
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Alternatively NZ will chase down 194 with overs to spare
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Old 18th February 2018, 08:56   #124
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Alternatively NZ will chase down 194 with overs to spare
I think the latter is looking quite likely.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:06   #125
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Oh dear. Well bowled chaps.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:08   #126
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Ugh.

Perhaps 194 is not a par score .

Are England lagging behind a la the Cook days of ODI ?
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:15   #127
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Bizarre not to bowl spin earlier. Dawson could have bowled like moeen does in power play. come on adil.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:26   #128
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What gets me is how interminable this period of limited overs cricket it is. After today, the 5 ODIS will start next Sunday and will not finish until March 10. I know DVS is hacked off at how little test cricket is scheduled for NZ but I thought the emphasis on longer ODI series was lessening but obviously not the case here.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:30   #129
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Bizarre not to bowl spin earlier. Dawson could have bowled like moeen does in power play. come on adil.
NZ can just accumulate now as the pressure is off.

Will flatter the spin bowlers economy rates of course . But the wickets column is crucial. No pressure so no risks taken.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:31   #130
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I’m claiming that one.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:37   #131
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This is a funny one for NZ. Do they set out to win the match or lose by 19? Sends all the wrong messages to aim to lose not too badly and could collapse in a heap, but why chase 20 more than needed.
Would have thought it easier than usual, either way they need to get around 175-195 so you set off the same way you would either end of that bracket.

So they set off aiming to reach 195 knowing they have plan B of reaching 175 if they're unable to get 195.

Rather academic now as they look well set to win. The saddest thing about this and DL is the sides know what they need to do so it takes an edge off the old fashioned principle of playing to win - in the case of DL the target being the target, not revised totals which are handed to every Tom, Dick and Harry of the media and cricket world and even stuck up on the scoreboard.

Kills the game for me, as does one side knowing they don't need to win they only need to get close to go through. Maybe tiebreakers should be done on wickets not runs, takes out the variance of pitches and conditions, as it would be the same for both participants (well as 'same' as you could get anyway)
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:37   #132
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I still back NZ to win comfortably because it will be too easy to bash the seam bowlers. Rashid has bowled out now.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:45   #133
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What gets me is how interminable this period of limited overs cricket it is. After today, the 5 ODIS will start next Sunday and will not finish until March 10. I know DVS is hacked off at how little test cricket is scheduled for NZ but I thought the emphasis on longer ODI series was lessening but obviously not the case here.
I'd guess with the Cricket World Cup around 15 months away they both want to get in some series, although triangulars would make more sense in ODIs now than T20Is but hey ho.



It is a little surprising England are only playing 2 Tests vs New Zealand, but as I have probably said before they tend to do a maximum 7 Tests in a Summer or Winter so put in a 4 and 3 or a 5 and 2, usually in the past England play combinations from West Indies, India, New Zealand, South Africa and Sri Lanka when wanting to do a 4 and 3, the usual opposition for a 2 would be Bangladesh (done with 5 vs India) or Zimbabwe (not in the picture currently)

Honestly with most Test series it's a waste playing 5, may soon all change though.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:52   #134
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I still back NZ to win comfortably because it will be too easy to bash the seam bowlers. Rashid has bowled out now.
I'd agree, even with that 2nd wicket and a bit of economy the kiwis are still in a strong position. Guptill well set, Chapman in, wickets in hand and we've already seen 17 go off one over of seam and it only takes 1-2 like that to make 11 an over look easy.

Not sure Morgan has a clue about captaincy, never have been impressed with his bowling changes/timings, especially in T20Is. You can't ignore your main bowlers, doesn't matter even if they went for 20 off their 1st over, you simply don't know the 6th choice or bit part bowler will fare any better and at this stage Malan might buy you a wicket, but the bowlers you include to bowl ie Jordan, Curran and Willy, should be first port of call to, I dunno, do their job......

England are now in a position of desperation, kiwis know they only need to get close and England will need to bowl miracle dot balls or take wickets so often the kiwis can't even get more than the odd 2 or 3.
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Old 18th February 2018, 09:57   #135
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There was realistically only one way England would win this and go through, to take a lot of wickets - they've taken two.

Amazes me still people believe economy is the answer, economy can be handy but wickets win you games in all formats. If you can't take wickets then you be buggered, probably the weakest part of England's game in the 90s, although selection policies didn't help.


EDIT : As I typed Malan has snared a wicket, even if a 'cunning plan' it was never likely to win England the game, and there's no point saving your death bowlers when the corpse (game) has had autopsy and been buried. Less than 10 runs needed now
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Old 18th February 2018, 10:14   #136
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Ultimately the bowling wasn't good enough. Got away with it in the ODIs thanks to poor pacing from Smith and Marsh in one, and maybe not approaching another with much sense either.

Still England will have home advantage next World Cup, I suspect they still won't win it as it doesn't give them an out an out clear advantage on some bowling attacks and England's batting is very good, but is it tournament winning good?

Last over, Curran showing why taking him off after one expensive over is tactically naÔve come stupid by Morgan. Sure the kiwis now don't need to win, but won't mean they don't wish to given they have wickets in hand and the runs needed was modest entering the final over.

Run a bye off the penultimate ball, four off final ball needed, good bowling from Curran. Thanks to him England win, but lost some runs ago.
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Old 18th February 2018, 10:27   #137
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17 wickets in the 4 games for England - not enough.
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Old 18th February 2018, 10:29   #138
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The crowd seemed totally unaware that NZ had qualified for the final. Was there no announcement? Absolute silence when the qualifying run was scored. The cheers only picked up when the batsmen were concentrating on winning the game. It’s fair enough, I suppose: the spectators had paid to see this match and wanted a win, here and now. But it was strange that there was no reaction at all to getting to the final.
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Old 18th February 2018, 10:43   #139
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I'd agree, even with that 2nd wicket and a bit of economy the kiwis are still in a strong position. Guptill well set, Chapman in, wickets in hand and we've already seen 17 go off one over of seam and it only takes 1-2 like that to make 11 an over look easy.

Not sure Morgan has a clue about captaincy, never have been impressed with his bowling changes/timings, especially in T20Is. You can't ignore your main bowlers, doesn't matter even if they went for 20 off their 1st over, you simply don't know the 6th choice or bit part bowler will fare any better and at this stage Malan might buy you a wicket, but the bowlers you include to bowl ie Jordan, Curran and Willy, should be first port of call to, I dunno, do their job......

England are now in a position of desperation, kiwis know they only need to get close and England will need to bowl miracle dot balls or take wickets so often the kiwis can't even get more than the odd 2 or 3.
I think the complete opposite, itís Morganís use and change of bowlers that has finally made England competitive in both short formats of the game. Root or Cook would have just bowled their pace bowlers into the ground, whereas Morgan appreciates its about making the opposition think their way through the innings. Heís a masterful captain and that was a classy 80 today.
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Old 18th February 2018, 10:50   #140
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Bit of a damp squib of a match. There was never any prospect of England winning by a margin of more than 20 runs.

T20 is simply too short a format for such wide gaps between two quality sides to occur except in the rarest circumstances. Apparently the last time England won a T20 match by more than 20 runs was in 2015.
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