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Old 4th January 2018, 08:02   #221
gmdf
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He's done it again, getting caught at square leg with 2.3 overs left in the day is a new low.
Can't help thinking being Skipper isn't helping him.
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Old 4th January 2018, 10:02   #222
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He's done it again, getting caught at square leg with 2.3 overs left in the day is a new low.
Not what the captain should be doing. Maybe he shouldn't be skipper, but who else could do it?

I would also have him and Malan one place up with one of Lawrence, Livingstone or Hales given a go at five. The other option would be Foakes keeping and YJB playing as a batsmen but maybe YJB enjoys keeping?
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Old 4th January 2018, 10:10   #223
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I’m sure Root doesn’t need the likes of me to tell him but his performances in this series have simply not been good enough. It’s not just the fact his conversion rate is awful he is getting himself out time after time. His dismissal today was as soft as it gets.
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Old 4th January 2018, 11:52   #224
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Not what the captain should be doing. Maybe he shouldn't be skipper, but who else could do it?
I don't see how being captain had anything to do with that dismissal - it would have been shameful for whoever had done it.
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Old 4th January 2018, 11:57   #225
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I don't see how being captain had anything to do with that dismissal - it would have been shameful for whoever had done it.
He has had a habit of doing this that has gone back well before he became captain. As I said right at the top of the thread, that his getting out in the 'non-conversion' zone is something that has really snowballed from the series v Pakistan in the UAE. Being captain has hardly affected Steve Smith's conversion rate.
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Old 4th January 2018, 13:30   #226
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Not what the captain should be doing. Maybe he shouldn't be skipper, but who else could do it? ...
Malan, Bairstow, Broad, or Anderson. There are probably negative aspects of each of those possibilities, but that is something they clearly now share with Root.
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Old 4th January 2018, 14:04   #227
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Malan, Bairstow, Broad, or Anderson. There are probably negative aspects of each of those possibilities, but that is something they clearly now share with Root.
It's funny, but from that list by far the most attractive option is Malan. Anderson is no long term option, Broad neither, Bairstow doesn't strike me as captaincy material.

Malan has been one of the few positives from this tour and seems to have a decent cricketing brain on him. He's got out to the odd stupid shot early on but seems to have learnt from that since.

But I still don't think being Captain is the problem for Root. I wonder if his back causes him concentration issues.
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Old 4th January 2018, 14:14   #228
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/42566445

BBC have woken up and realised Root conversion issues. Shows how ahead of the game we are on here!
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Old 4th January 2018, 17:30   #229
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Although the previous master certainly deserved to have the thread so named, Root’s 2 years and more effort to nigh on outdo said master has made it very difficult for me not to change it. To be honest I have prevaricated for long enough not to change it and Root’s own continuation has at least justified it. I had been hoping he would snap out of it and try and truly belong amongst the likes of Williamson and Kohli but he has failed and thus deserves his billing.
It belittles the recognition originally given in naming this thread to subsequently add another name to it. You could make similar arguments to remane the commentators thread the "Richie Benaud and Nick Knight Commentators Thread"; or for many left leaning councils to start calling various tower blocks "Nelson Mandela and Jacob Zuna Estates" .
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Old 4th January 2018, 18:00   #230
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No doubt Root has a problem converting fifties to hundreds - but the problem is exaggerated because of how damn good he is at getting to fifty in the first place (and any batsman will tell you that getting a start is the most difficult thing about batting).

His 50/innings ratio is better than Steve Smith, Ponting, Lara and Sangakkara just to name a few greats.

Take someone like Virat Kohli - who is not as good a Test batsman as Root. With 20 hundreds and 15 fifties, his conversion is obviously excellent. But he also gets to fifty only every 3.02 innings - compared to every 2.40 innings for Root. As an even more extreme example, Michael Vaughan had 18 centuries and 18 fifties - but he only got to a fifty every fourth innings.

So yes, there is no denying Root has a problem, but it is being exaggerated because of how brilliant he is.
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Old 4th January 2018, 22:18   #231
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Root's dismissal today was what is known as a strangle. It was a bad ball which was there to be put away but he just made a mess of the shot.
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Old 4th January 2018, 22:25   #232
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Take someone like Virat Kohli - who is not as good a Test batsman as Root. .
Root is a class below Kohli. Being a good test batsman is about being able to convert your 50s into match defining innings of substance, which Kohli does regularly, and Root hardly at all anymore.
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Old 5th January 2018, 09:15   #233
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Root is a class below Kohli. Being a good test batsman is about being able to convert your 50s into match defining innings of substance, which Kohli does regularly, and Root hardly at all anymore.
A fair point, although worth noting that Kohli doesn't make it to 50 nearly as often as Root.
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Old 5th January 2018, 09:22   #234
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It belittles the recognition originally given in naming this thread to subsequently add another name to it. You could make similar arguments to remane the commentators thread the "Richie Benaud and Nick Knight Commentators Thread"; or for many left leaning councils to start calling various tower blocks "Nelson Mandela and Jacob Zuna Estates" .
I would like to point out, I only originally named it "the pretty little fifties thread" and didn't add the "IR Bell" part to it. Although Bell was undoubtedly deserving of much of the criticism that came his way for not converting enough, in my opinion he has now been outstripped by Root. Indeed it was of the markedly increasing trend a year ago that I decided to start the thread. Although Bell was a hugely frustrating player to watch, Root has a greater all round batting game. IMO Root would be a genuine great of the game if he had converted even another half dozen or so of the number of 50s he's scored, yet it becomes inevitable on him reaching 50 that he is going to get out soon afterwards.
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Old 5th January 2018, 10:10   #235
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A fair point, although worth noting that Kohli doesn't make it to 50 nearly as often as Root.
Great. Now tell me how many scores of 53 have defined a test match?
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Old 5th January 2018, 10:25   #236
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Great. Now tell me how many scores of 53 have defined a test match?
I hear you.....And yet the irony is, Root had some stat at the start of his career whereby he had more MOTM awards per match than anyone else. That sure ain't holding up anymore.
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Old 5th January 2018, 10:28   #237
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Root is a class below Kohli. Being a good test batsman is about being able to convert your 50s into match defining innings of substance, which Kohli does regularly, and Root hardly at all anymore.
Who would one prefer as No. 4 & Captain, Root or Kohli?


I think I'd go for Virat...
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Old 5th January 2018, 10:40   #238
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Root is a class below Kohli. Being a good test batsman is about being able to convert your 50s into match defining innings of substance, which Kohli does regularly, and Root hardly at all anymore.
That's part of it, not everything. Part of being great is also the consistency and at least that part Root has nailed! I wouldn't agree he's a "class below" - to me that means clear daylight and given that Kohli's churning of massive scores have come on this lengthy run of fixtures in similar conditions there's obviously a massive caveat.

I don't think anyone could argue at the moment that Root is ahead of Kohli precisely because of his impotence when set but it is an interesting question as to whether 4 ducks and a 250 is better than 5 scores of 50 (if, like England, you have a team of players who make 50s but not 100s, then a single "match-defining innings" is lot rarer than people think - look at the tallies of big scores in the last Ashes). Looking at reaction to Cook's score shows there's no consistency of thought in this question across the board because all we heard from his detractors was that "one innings doesn't change anything".
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Old 5th January 2018, 11:39   #239
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Root is a class below Kohli. Being a good test batsman is about being able to convert your 50s into match defining innings of substance, which Kohli does regularly, and Root hardly at all anymore.
Root is a class behind Kohli but being able to convert 50s is a rubbish definition of being a good test batsman.

Would you rather someone who converted every time they passed 50 but only passed 50 one in twenty innings or would you rather someone who passed 50 every innings but only converted every fifth time they passed 50?
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 5th January 2018, 11:48   #240
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AB De Villiers, in his 108th test match he has added his 41st score of 50+ but <100 with his 65 v India. He has 21 tons. A bit disappointing really for a player of his undoubted talent too.
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