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Old 17th January 2017, 21:49   #161
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All-Time Best XI not to have played a test? The ones off the top of my head are;

David Hussey
Michael Di Venuto
Jamie Siddons
Clive Rice
Ryan Ten Doeschate
Steve Tikolo
Eddie Gilbert


Surely theres a few more aparthied era Saffers that would be in there as well. Struggling to think of more bowlers and a keeper.
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Old 17th January 2017, 22:18   #162
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Originally Posted by MRNC4.0 View Post
All-Time Best XI not to have played a test? The ones off the top of my head are;

David Hussey
Michael Di Venuto
Jamie Siddons
Clive Rice
Ryan Ten Doeschate
Steve Tikolo
Eddie Gilbert


Surely theres a few more aparthied era Saffers that would be in there as well. Struggling to think of more bowlers and a keeper.
Fancy a wee bit of Niall o'Brien as the keeper.
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Old 17th January 2017, 22:27   #163
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Ed Joyce is up there, but there still may be time yet for a Test debut.
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Old 17th January 2017, 22:30   #164
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Old 17th January 2017, 22:37   #165
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Originally Posted by MRNC4.0 View Post
All-Time Best XI not to have played a test? The ones off the top of my head are;

David Hussey
Michael Di Venuto
Jamie Siddons
Clive Rice
Ryan Ten Doeschate
Steve Tikolo
Eddie Gilbert


Surely theres a few more aparthied era Saffers that would be in there as well. Struggling to think of more bowlers and a keeper.
Garth Le Roux as a quick and useful #9.
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Old 18th January 2017, 02:48   #166
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Garth Le Roux as a quick and useful #9.
Vince van der Bijl didn't play either and would more than have warranted a Test place.

Ken McEwan would be my pick, given he played for many years for an excellent Essex team and would also have played Tests given the chance.

Henry Fotheringham would deserve a spot as opener, you'd think.

Ray Jennings for keeper? Perhaps Stephen Jefferies as a #8/bowler. Bit of variety with the left-armers.

Could even argue for Zimbabwe's Duncan Fletcher or Peter Rawson as the pre-Test Zimbabweans with the best pedigree to have deserved to play Tests.

And going well back in the day, the USA's Bart King was apparently something to behold in the early 1900s.

Probably some pre-Test 'Lankans that I've forgotten as well.
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Old 18th January 2017, 04:53   #167
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Vince van der Bijl didn't play either and would more than have warranted a Test place.

Ken McEwan would be my pick, given he played for many years for an excellent Essex team and would also have played Tests given the chance.

Henry Fotheringham would deserve a spot as opener, you'd think.

Ray Jennings for keeper? Perhaps Stephen Jefferies as a #8/bowler. Bit of variety with the left-armers.

Could even argue for Zimbabwe's Duncan Fletcher or Peter Rawson as the pre-Test Zimbabweans with the best pedigree to have deserved to play Tests.

And going well back in the day, the USA's Bart King was apparently something to behold in the early 1900s.

Probably some pre-Test 'Lankans that I've forgotten as well.
Alot of names I need to research there. Thanks for the history lesson.
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Old 18th January 2017, 07:53   #168
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I once took part in a draft of Associate players, and here's the team that I came up with at the time (and their first class stats)

Code:
					Bat		Bowl			Nationality
1. James Aitchison 			2,786 @ 32.77				Scotland
2. Ravindu Shah				1,623 @ 49.18	(RMF) 5 @ 33.60		Kenya
3. Brian Hardie				18,103 @ 34.22	(RM) 3 @ 84.66		Scotland
4. Craig Williams (7)			4,970 @ 39.76	(RM) 89 @ 36.49		Namibia
5. Gerrie Snyman (6)			4,100 @ 39.04	(RFM) 68 @ 38.27	Namibia
6. Ryan ten Doeschate (5)		6,426 @ 46.90	(RMF) 182 @ 33.90	Netherlands
7. Stuart Robertson (+)			4,343 @ 33.15	(112 dismissals)	Rhodesia
8. Mohammad Nabi (4)			1,048 @ 26.87	(ROS) 61 @ 24.60	Afghanistan
9. Duncan Fletcher (1)			4,095 @ 23.67	(RFM) 215 @ 28.03	Rhodesia/Zimbabwe
10. Jimmy Allan (3)			4,988 @ 22.36	(SLA) 435 @ 25.69	Scotland
11. Peter Rawson (2)			1,976 @ 20.80	(RFM) 257 @ 23.90	Zimbabwe
Some of these are still current players, mostly with the Namibians.

We did some short pen-pic bios for some of these guys at the time, so here's a few:

Ryan ten Doeschate - born in Port Elizabeth. His second game of first class cricket was for a Western Province Youth XI against the touring Netherlands. Tendo didn't do well (outperformed by J Wiggle, as it happens). He didn't make much progress in the Western Province set-up and in 2003 he moved to Essex, where he has played since. Much like the A-Team, he has become a soldier of fortune; just simply in T20 leagues (and I don't believe he was wrongly imprisoned, and if he shoots people I suspect they die or at least get hurt, unlike side-characters from the A Team who would get blown up and be perfectly fine afterwards). He medium to medium-fast bowler, but only ever really a part timer, he's more famous for his batting. He has 'torn up' for the Dutch in the Intercontinental Cup averaging 142.77 for them in first class games. For Essex, he's averaged 40 with the bat over a long period and he wouldn't have looked out of place at a higher level, especially in ODIs where he's averaged 67 for the Dutch.

Bart King - A class act amongst the thoroughly decent "Gentlemen of Philadelphia" sides who toured England in 1897, 1903 and 1908 and played against the counties, and probably should have played England - he, some would say, invented "swerve" bowling and took more than 400 wickets at around 15 in First Class cricket - no mean batsman either he got a ton against the full strength of Surrey in 1903, and averaged 20 over his career

The greatest batsman from Ceylon's pre-Test era, Mahadevan Satahasivam was described by no lesser authority than Sir Garfield Sobers as "the greatest batsman ever on earth", and by Frank Worrell as "the greatest batsman [he] had ever seen". He's perhaps the only man to have not only represented, but captained, three national teams - those of Ceylon, Singapore and Malaysia (it is rumoured that the ECB has recently called to request his services).

He's been called the "Sri Lankan Keith Miller" for his partying ways, and had the Doug Walters-like knack of scoring tons after drinking through 'til dawn. And, umm, of somewhat more concern, he was accused, arrested and subsequently acquitted of murdering his wife, meaning he isn't nearly as morally abhorrent a selection as, say, Roy Gilchrist. FC batting average of 40 from 11 games played early on in his lengthy career.

James Aitchison - A decent first class record, and that's without his defining innings - a century against the touring Australians in 1956 - a line-up featuring Lindwall, Davidson, Miller and Benaud. Also carried his bat for a ton against the touring South Africans in 1947.

The Scotsman newspaper of the day noted in 1947: "Altogether it was an encouraging day for Scottish Cricket, for South Africa fielded eight Test men and most of the bowlers who will be playing against England this week. With a bit of help from Sheppard, Aitchison provided a very solid bulwark to the tourists' bowling, and, though giving the semblance of a chance at 49, played some brilliant cricket during his stay of 250 minutes. He hit thirteen 4s, excelling so much in his drives through cover-point, that the South African captain, Nourse, had to strengthen the position, though, as soon as he sealed up the gap there, Aitchison got boundaries with some hefty hitting to long-on."

Gerrie Snyman had a tough baptism to international cricket, starting for Namibia at the 2003 World Cup and making 3 golden ducks in 4 innings. Back then, he opened the bowling for Namibia and batted in the lower order. As time has progressed he has matured somewhat like Ryan ten Doeschate with his bowling (a bustling medium-fast) becoming a much smaller part of his game. Alongside this, however, his batting has matured. This is in no small part due to his time in the UK with county 2nd XIs, Staffordshire and in numerous club competitions. His development was further bolstered in 2006 when Namibia were allowed entry into the South African 2nd tier - a first class tournament which acts as a feeder league to South African franchise cricket. Sadly, these days he is much more likely to be found playing T20s and ODIs as Nambia add to their non-Intercontinental Cup schedule at the same time of year as the Namibian foray into first class cricket.

A destructive batsman when at his best, Snyman's career highlight has to be his 230 against Kenya in a low scoring game in Sharjah. In a score of 282 all out where only one other batsman reached double figures, Snyman launched an incredible assault against the Kenyan attack - scoring 230 runs in 201 balls. This was nearly 30% of the total runs scored in the match and featured 11 sixes and 21 fours. The Kenyan attack of the day was one of their most illustrious - featuring Thomas Odoyo, Peter Ongondo, Nehemiah Odhiambo and Collins Obuya.

In the late 1970s Dermott Monteith considered himself, behind Bishan Bedi and Dilip Doshi, to be the third best slow left arm bowler in the world. Then Doshi visited Ireland, and he promoted himself to second, and then Bish's powers started to wane so in his own mind he was left as the finest in the game. How good he was we will never know of course, but at 38 in 1981 he played occasionally for Middlesex when John Emburey and Phil Edmonds were absent and he took 24 wickets at 24 with two five-fers so he must have been pretty good.

Tommy Kelaart - greatest off-spinner Sri Lanks has ever produced - he averaged 5 runs a wicket over his career in senior cricket and is the only man from his country who ever dismissed WG Grace

Ole Mortensen -One of the associate GOAT's. Averaged low 20's in FC cricket despite the vast majority of those games being in county cricket. Was rated by his then captain Kim Barnett as "the best bowler to have never played Test cricket".

Kevin Curran - Zimbabwean all-rounder who represented his country in the 1983 and 87 World Cups and was one of the most effective international players in county cricket for over a decade. Unfortunately by the time Zimbabwe received Test status he was well entrenched in county cricket and wasn't tempted back. RIP.

Derrick de Saram - Was hyped up as one of the best Sri Lankan batsmen pre-Test cricket. Scored 128 for Oxford University against an Australian side containing McCabe, Grimmett and Fleetwood-Smith.

Brian Davison - Was a fast-scoring batsman, athletic fielder and part-time bowler for many years in county and Shield cricket, as well as for Rhodesia (where he failed to produce the same sort of form he did for Leicestershire, strangely). For whatever reason never played international cricket, possibly because of county commitments. After retiring from cricket became a Liberal MP in Tasmania .

I really like following associate cricket. A shame there isn't more of it on the TV, as I'd probably watch an associate T20, OD or FC game ahead of any other international ODI or T20. Watched a few Hong Kong games on streaming, as they seem to show them (which is nice).
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Old 18th January 2017, 21:06   #169
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I saw Dermott Montieth play back when I was at school. He was very good.
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Old 23rd January 2017, 03:10   #170
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Strauss All Time XI

Trescothick
Cook
Langer
Kallis
Tendulkar
Lara
Gilchrist
Warne
Morkel
McGrath
Akhtar
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Old 23rd January 2017, 04:56   #171
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Some of these ex-players have a somewhat dubious understanding of "all time"
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Old 23rd January 2017, 10:11   #172
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Still no Lohmann.
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Old 23rd January 2017, 13:33   #173
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Strauss All Time XI

Trescothick
Cook
Langer
Kallis
Tendulkar
Lara
Gilchrist
Warne
Morkel
McGrath
Akhtar
Is this from the Cricket Paper - I haven't taken it for a while, but isn't the premise of these XI's players they have played with/against
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Old 23rd January 2017, 14:02   #174
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Is this from the Cricket Paper - I haven't taken it for a while, but isn't the premise of these XI's players they have played with/against
No, from Lords on Twitter. It looks to be players to have played in the same era. Strauss probably found those bowlers the most difficult to face.

McCullum had Boult and Southee in his XI.
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Old 23rd January 2017, 21:05   #175
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I'm going to have a stab at an associate all time XI and I will be excluding any associate player who has played for a full ICC member nation i.e. the 10 test playing nations.

1. W. Porterfield IRL
2. M. Shahzad AFG
3. RT. Doeschate NL
4. S. Tikolo KEN
5. K. O'Brien IRL
6. P. Stirling IRL
7. N. O'Brien IRL wk/c
8. T. Odoyo KEN
9. M. Haq SCOT
10. O. Mortensen DEN
11. H. Hassan AFG
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Old 23rd January 2017, 21:18   #176
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Any associate XI that doesn't have big Dwayne isn't worth considering.
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Old 23rd January 2017, 21:45   #177
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Anyone help with creating a Suits you, oo-er missus, clean yer mouth out XI?"

So far I've got de Kock, Dickwella, Willey, Willey, Bumrah...
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Old 23rd January 2017, 22:25   #178
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Anyone help with creating a Suits you, oo-er missus, clean yer mouth out XI?"

So far I've got de Kock, Dickwella, Willey, Willey, Bumrah...
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Old 26th January 2017, 10:34   #179
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Fred Titmus, Bernard Constable, Minnie Patel, Chris Old-Man, David Stiff...and of course, Somerset's Dick Harden.
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Old 26th January 2017, 10:41   #180
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