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Old 5th May 2015, 19:33   #41
Jock McTuffnel v3
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Originally Posted by CDogg16 View Post
All this talk of not having options is a joke. Who would have said Swann would have become phenonomon he was before he was selected.

Here are some county spinners who could be given a go, and before they are tried we don't know if their good enough.

Danny Briggs
Adam Riley
Ravi Patel
Adil Rashid
Yeah but can they bat in the top 6 ?
Cook and Moores ain't interested unless they can bat.
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Old 5th May 2015, 19:38   #42
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I'd like to point out that we do have a spinner who averages less than 30 in both Tests and ODIs. For me there is no need to look past Tredwell for the immediate future.
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Old 5th May 2015, 19:41   #43
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I'd like to point out that we do have a spinner who averages less than 30 in both Tests and ODIs. For me there is no need to look past Tredwell for the immediate future.
He's probably got another six years in him. I rate him as a better spinner than Moeen.
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Old 5th June 2015, 10:16   #44
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Moeen - I wasn't very good and don't like bowling in the cold and wind and certain times of the day.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cri...-cost-him.html

"“I struggled at Leeds,” he said. “There were a few reasons for it. Conditions were very tough to bowl in. It was windy, it was cold and the timings were tough. I couldn’t feel my fingers for the first few overs I bowled.”"
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Old 5th June 2015, 10:36   #45
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Originally Posted by Jock McTuffnel v3 View Post
Moeen - I wasn't very good and don't like bowling in the cold and wind and certain times of the day.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cri...-cost-him.html

"“I struggled at Leeds,” he said. “There were a few reasons for it. Conditions were very tough to bowl in. It was windy, it was cold and the timings were tough. I couldn’t feel my fingers for the first few overs I bowled.”"
"A very strong aussie side"

Their batting is not that strong.

Re moeen - he sounds honest. Do fast bowlers get slated when they can't bowl 8 over spells in hot sun? If a spin bowler is so cold that he can't feel his fingers then this is similar isn't it?
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Old 5th June 2015, 10:49   #46
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"A very strong aussie side"

Their batting is not that strong.

Re moeen - he sounds honest. Do fast bowlers get slated when they can't bowl 8 over spells in hot sun? If a spin bowler is so cold that he can't feel his fingers then this is similar isn't it?
To be fair though he wasn't great in the Carribean, and I doubt it was too cold for him there.
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Old 5th June 2015, 11:41   #47
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He had been injured and didn't have any bowling under belt in the WI. In this series he had 4 dropped catches off his bowling.
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Old 5th June 2015, 15:29   #48
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He had been injured and didn't have any bowling under belt in the WI. In this series he had 4 dropped catches off his bowling.
cold
lack of bowling
dropped catches
windy

Probably why Murali never took any wickets in England..
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Old 5th June 2015, 15:32   #49
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What did he do to you Jock?
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 5th June 2015, 15:39   #50
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What did he do to you Jock?
Him - nothing. I feel a bit sorry for him - his part time bowling has been thrust forward as the answer and he has been relegated to 8 in the batting - he's been humiliated.

The selectors however have slapped me in the face with the wet haddock of fobbing us off with a batsman who turns his arm over as the specialist spinner in the team.
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Old 5th June 2015, 15:47   #51
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You seem to take it very personally.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 5th June 2015, 15:53   #52
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You seem to take it very personally.
I care about spin bowling. And having paid a lot of money for England tickets I've seen with my own eyes that this is an experiment that should cease now.

I'm sure Allan Knot fans felt similar when Alec Stewart and Geraint Jones were shelling catches for fun.
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Old 5th June 2015, 17:00   #53
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It was quite warm on the fifth day at lords when I saw him bowl some utter filth.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:23   #54
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Chemistry needs to be his friend. Does he not use iron based hand-warmers as opposed to the reusable sodium ethanoate ones?
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Old 6th June 2015, 07:38   #55
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It was quite warm on the fifth day at lords when I saw him bowl some utter filth.
me too at Trent Bridge last summer.
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Old 6th June 2015, 11:11   #56
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I'd like to point out that we do have a spinner who averages less than 30 in both Tests and ODIs. For me there is no need to look past Tredwell for the immediate future.
If Ali could improve on his batting then there's no reason England couldn't play both with Ali in the support spin role rather than Root (to him)

But I think England are going back to the Flintoff days of five bowler theory, when it used to be Flintoff-Jones-Giles 6-8.

Personally I'd keep Stokes in ODIs only for now, others will probably want him to work on his bowling whilst staying in the side, but England clearly lack enough punch in the bowling department as neither the kiwis nor windies are great sides yet we couldn't beat them despite plenty of batting - even if it failed when it mattered - twice.
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Old 6th June 2015, 11:42   #57
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Personally I'd keep Stokes in ODIs only for now, others will probably want him to work on his bowling whilst staying in the side, but England clearly lack enough punch in the bowling department as neither the kiwis nor windies are great sides yet we couldn't beat them despite plenty of batting - even if it failed when it mattered - twice.
Just one test ago Stokes effectively played not one but two match winning innings as well taking three key second innings wickets, including New Zealand's two premier batsmen is successive balls. I find it quite staggering that anybody would consider leaving him out. Yes, he's inconsistent but he is quite clearly a match winner.
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Old 6th June 2015, 12:24   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jock McTuffnel v3 View Post
cold
lack of bowling
dropped catches
windy

Probably why Murali never took any wickets in England..
It may have been his bowling action that would account for that.
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Old 6th June 2015, 13:11   #59
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If Ali could improve on his batting then there's no reason England couldn't play both with Ali in the support spin role rather than Root (to him)
I completely agree with this. If Bell or Ballance continue to struggle and are dropped, I think Moeen could do a job at four or five. I would say he is the outstanding candidate to be Bell's long term successor, he sort of classy batsman who can score runs quickly and stylishly.

Quote:
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Personally I'd keep Stokes in ODIs only for now, others will probably want him to work on his bowling whilst staying in the side, but England clearly lack enough punch in the bowling department as neither the kiwis nor windies are great sides yet we couldn't beat them despite plenty of batting - even if it failed when it mattered - twice.
This is what I thought before the NZ series. However, now I think he is fine at six because his batting looks good, but he can't be relied on as the fourth bowler. Therefore by having him in the side I don't think Moeen can be in as a bowler, because then you have two bowlers who are very inconsistent. For now I would drop Moeen and play Rashid, and see how Stokes get on.
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Old 6th June 2015, 14:32   #60
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I completely agree with this. If Bell or Ballance continue to struggle and are dropped, I think Moeen could do a job at four or five. I would say he is the outstanding candidate to be Bell's long term successor, he sort of classy batsman who can score runs quickly and stylishly.



This is what I thought before the NZ series. However, now I think he is fine at six because his batting looks good, but he can't be relied on as the fourth bowler. Therefore by having him in the side I don't think Moeen can be in as a bowler, because then you have two bowlers who are very inconsistent. For now I would drop Moeen and play Rashid, and see how Stokes get on.
We will know more about Rashid after the NZ one dayers, which will be a bit of a baptism by fire as a precursor to being our spinner candidate for Australia.
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