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Old 1st January 2016, 20:04   #301
Ali TT
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The quota system both reduces flexibility while paradoxically adding uncertainty to the selection process. However I think it's an excuse to blame it for their current woes. I don't know much about SA domestic cricket but if the likes of van Zyl, Vilas, Morris are the best of the rest among the white players I would wager there are bigger problems in the game. Based upon his domestic record Duminy is easily in the side by right, he has just failed to reach his potential in test cricket. I don't think that's to do with quotas, there are plenty of examples of talented players of all colours and nationalities never quite making it.
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Old 1st January 2016, 20:16   #302
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The quota system both reduces flexibility while paradoxically adding uncertainty to the selection process. However I think it's an excuse to blame it for their current woes. I don't know much about SA domestic cricket but if the likes of van Zyl, Vilas, Morris are the best of the rest among the white players I would wager there are bigger problems in the game. Based upon his domestic record Duminy is easily in the side by right, he has just failed to reach his potential in test cricket. I don't think that's to do with quotas, there are plenty of examples of talented players of all colours and nationalities never quite making it.
Quite. It's funny how this wasn't an issue while SA were top but now that they're struggling, rumour and conjecture is all taken as fact. There are quite a few xfactors, including your list, and the loss of Kallis Smith and a few players' form that are tangible and significant.
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Old 1st January 2016, 20:19   #303
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Yeah, I've never thought Duminy as a quota player at all. He made that magnificent hundred in Australia, looks a million dollars at the crease when in form and seemed to have a successful Test career written all over his game. For whatever reason it hasn't quite worked out (yet - still only 31) but there are any number of players who don't quite fulfill their potential as Ali says. India have three recent examples - Yuvraj, Raina, Rohit Sharma - who were touted as special talents but all three failed at Test level.
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Old 1st January 2016, 20:53   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali TT View Post
The quota system both reduces flexibility while paradoxically adding uncertainty to the selection process. However I think it's an excuse to blame it for their current woes. I don't know much about SA domestic cricket but if the likes of van Zyl, Vilas, Morris are the best of the rest among the white players I would wager there are bigger problems in the game. Based upon his domestic record Duminy is easily in the side by right, he has just failed to reach his potential in test cricket. I don't think that's to do with quotas, there are plenty of examples of talented players of all colours and nationalities never quite making it.
This is exactly the point I im making If the "white" players are "crap" putting in second rate "coloured (i hate the word)players " becauce you have to is madness

Stop hiding behind your previous pejudices SA and pick your best players

Why QD C is not in the starting side is beside me.....Oh yes the quota
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Old 1st January 2016, 21:03   #305
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Duminy was my denley. I warched his early innings in Oz (on TV) and texted my mate that this guy was going to be special. Oops.
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Old 1st January 2016, 21:17   #306
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This is exactly the point I im making If the "white" players are "crap" putting in second rate "coloured (i hate the word)players " becauce you have to is madness

Stop hiding behind your previous pejudices SA and pick your best players

Why QD C is not in the starting side is beside me.....Oh yes the quota
De Kock should be in the side but was it the quota keeping him out when Vilas was playing in India?

Bavuma doesn't look test class, so I can see why one might question his position, although I could easily say the same about van Zyl. However of the others in and around the squad, Amla is world class but out of nick, we've discussed Duminy, Piedt has done better than other spinners of late and Rabada is very highly rated but raw.
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Old 1st January 2016, 21:18   #307
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Yeah, I've never thought Duminy as a quota player at all. He made that magnificent hundred in Australia, looks a million dollars at the crease when in form and seemed to have a successful Test career written all over his game. For whatever reason it hasn't quite worked out
Erm

Espn is down at the moment but I would expect from his inclusion in the side he has contibuted 100 runs in the match 4? times in 40? tests...Hardly prolific

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For whatever reason it hasn't quite worked out (yet - still only 31)
Dare I suggest he is no tgood enough and is only in the side as a quota player - I dont remember him getting a bowl in the 1st test but I may have been queueing at the castle stand!!

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India have three recent examples - Yuvraj, Raina, Rohit Sharma - who were touted as special talents but all three failed at Test level.
We all have them, Morgan Hales Jordan (dare i mention it) Jossy boy et al...

Like I say espn is down at the moment but I would put a small wager on Rohit having better batting stats that Dumbum....
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Old 1st January 2016, 21:32   #308
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De Kock should be in the side but was it the quota keeping him out when Vilas was playing in India?

Bavuma doesn't look test class, so I can see why one might question his position, although I could easily say the same about van Zyl. However of the others in and around the squad, Amla is world class but out of nick, we've discussed Duminy, Piedt has done better than other spinners of late and Rabada is very highly rated but raw.
Simply because AB has to carry the gloves to maintain the Quota - Bavuma adds nothinhg to the side Van Zly is not an opener but a decent miiddle order man - Amla is a world class batsman but as good a captain a Botham was...Duminy is crap, Piedt has done well and I have not seen Rabada but as the safas look like they will be without two seemers he will be worth a go but as usual if Jo Root gets a goot taste of him he will never bee seen of again...

Suds for me

Elgar
Morris
Hashim
Ledge
Faff
Van Zly
Q de Q
Rabada
Piedt
Abbot (if Fit)
Snorkle


Still a bit slim with 3 seamers and 1 spinner but kick Van Z a little and he could fill in
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Old 1st January 2016, 22:01   #309
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Erm

Espn is down at the moment but I would expect from his inclusion in the side he has contibuted 100 runs in the match 4? times in 40? tests...Hardly prolific



Dare I suggest he is no tgood enough and is only in the side as a quota player - I dont remember him getting a bowl in the 1st test but I may have been queueing at the castle stand!!



We all have them, Morgan Hales Jordan (dare i mention it) Jossy boy et al...

Like I say espn is down at the moment but I would put a small wager on Rohit having better batting stats that Dumbum....
Bit cruel to say Hales has failed at Test level after one test
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Old 1st January 2016, 22:06   #310
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Bit cruel to say Hales has failed at Test level after one test
No - I take your point but unless he can get to Warner status he will not succeed

Dont get me wrong I would love him to be "our" Warner but I fear the pressure will make him revert into a style of player he is not...
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Old 7th January 2016, 01:01   #311
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Philander is out of the series. Steyn is 50/50 for the next test, which probably means he should be rested given his tendency to break down during tests recently. Stephen Cook could come in for van zyl.
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Old 7th January 2016, 10:10   #312
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Philander is out of the series. Steyn is 50/50 for the next test, which probably means he should be rested given his tendency to break down during tests recently. Stephen Cook could come in for van zyl.
I wouldn't pick him on those odds then, like you say it's simply not worth the risk.

Not sure what bowling attack i would utilise mind. I guess Morkel picks himself, whilst Pietd has done realtively considering what's come before in the spin department. The jury remains out on Morris but that extra batting at number eight looks essential to combat how deep England bat and at the same time he did bowl some handy spells. The current makeup looks a bowler short but i guess it's always gonig to be a bowler or batsmen light given what's avaliable.
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Old 8th January 2016, 11:15   #313
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South Africa ODI squad:

AB de Villiers (capt), Kyle Abbott, Hashim Amla, Farhaan Behardien, Quinton de Kock, JP Duminy, Faf du Plessis, Imran Tahir, David Miller, Morne Morkel, Chris Morris, Kagiso Rabada, Rilee Rossouw, Dale Steyn.

10 of the Test squad in the 14.
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Old 10th January 2016, 11:20   #314
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Just to add a link for the squad 1000yardstare has put which also includes South Africa's Test squad and a few quotes/additional snippets

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/35260457

South Africa have included Dale Steyn in their squad for the two remaining Tests against England.

The fast bowler missed the second Test in Cape Town with a shoulder injury as England survived a dramatic final day to draw and retain their 1-0 lead.

Fellow paceman Vernon Philander misses out on the next Test, which starts on 14 January, with an ankle injury.




The hosts will be led by AB de Villiers after Hashim Amla resigned the captaincy following the second Test.

If England win in Cape Town, they will take an unassailable lead in the four-Test series after a 241-run victory in the first Test in Durban.

South Africa have also named a 14-man squad for the five-match one-day international series starting on 3 February.

Slow left-armer Aaron Phangiso drops out of the squad that won their most recent ODI series in India but batsman Rilee Rossouw is fit again.

"We were highly encouraged by the performance put up by the Proteas at Newlands," said selection convener Linda Zondi.

"The very fact they were nearly able to force a win after conceding 600 runs on the first innings speaks volumes for the character of this group.

"We feel we have all our bases covered and also the options that will enable the team to exploit whatever conditions they encounter at the Bidvest Wanderers Stadium and at SuperSport Park."


And the Test squad :

South Africa Test squad

AB de Villiers (capt), Kyle Abbott, Hashim Amla, Temba Bavuma, Quinton de Kock, JP Duminy, Faf du Plessis, Dean Elgar, Morne Morkel, Chris Morris, Dane Piedt, Kagiso Rabada, Rilee Rossouw, Dale Steyn, Stiaan van Zyl, Hardus Viljoen.
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Old 13th January 2016, 14:26   #315
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Piedt released so SA will play an all pace attack.
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Old 13th January 2016, 14:30   #316
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Presumably Duminy will return
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Old 13th January 2016, 16:34   #317
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Cricinfo
South Africa (possible) 1 Dean Elgar, 2 Quinton de Kock (wk), 3 Hashim Amla, 4 AB de Villiers (capt), 5 Faf du Plessis, 6 Temba Bavuma, 7 JP Duminy, 8 Chris Morris, 9 Kagiso Rabada, 10 Hardus Viljoen, 11 Morne Morkel

Could de Kock open and keep wicket?
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Old 13th January 2016, 16:56   #318
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Cricinfo
South Africa (possible) 1 Dean Elgar, 2 Quinton de Kock (wk), 3 Hashim Amla, 4 AB de Villiers (capt), 5 Faf du Plessis, 6 Temba Bavuma, 7 JP Duminy, 8 Chris Morris, 9 Kagiso Rabada, 10 Hardus Viljoen, 11 Morne Morkel

Could de Kock open and keep wicket?
I suppose he could at a pinch, but it's only a couple of weeks since everyone was up in arms about the cheek of asking de Villiers to bat at 4 and keep wicket.

If they've dropped Piedt because they think they don't need a spinner, I don't see why they would recall Duminy. Elgar bowled more than he did in the first test anyway.
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Old 13th January 2016, 17:14   #319
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I suppose he could at a pinch, but it's only a couple of weeks since everyone was up in arms about the cheek of asking de Villiers to bat at 4 and keep wicket.

If they've dropped Piedt because they think they don't need a spinner, I don't see why they would recall Duminy. Elgar bowled more than he did in the first test anyway.
They need to have four non white players Sans so Duminy will return at the expense of Van Zyl. QDK will open and keep wicket it seems, as suggested by Cricinfo.
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Old 14th January 2016, 21:32   #320
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They need to have four non white players Sans so Duminy will return at the expense of Van Zyl. QDK will open and keep wicket it seems, as suggested by Cricinfo.
I heard that there is no such quota, it's just something some white people like to pretend exists so that they can moan about it. Meanwhile we await developments to see whether there is any sense in the dropping of Piedt. With turn evident on day one and SA set to bowl last, it looks like it could be a bit of an error.
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