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Old 3rd June 2015, 17:01   #101
oldandfat
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Originally Posted by sanskritsimon View Post
I would imagine that Rashid has been picked to give him some international exposure and thus to allow them to make a more informed decision about whether or not he is likely to be a better test bowler than the disappointing Ali. Tredwell they already know is a better test bowler than Ali but seemingly he lacks the batting that Rashid and Ali can offer. There is also presumably the option of playing two spinners at Cardiff, where there is unlikely to be much in the pitch for the seamers. Basically this ODI series is a complete waste of time unless it can help us improve our dismal test side for the Ashes series. There are plenty of ODIs in which to drop everyone and pick them all again several times before the next worthwhile ODI series.
Really? How? Ali has struggled since coming back from injury but bowled well against the Indians. Tredwell isn't picked by his County.
I believe the reason that Tredwell is not in the ODI squad (I would have played him in every ODI over the last two years) is that the coach has asked for a team of really good fielders.
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Old 3rd June 2015, 17:27   #102
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Originally Posted by oldandfat View Post
Really? How? Ali has struggled since coming back from injury but bowled well against the Indians. Tredwell isn't picked by his County ...
I think the reason why Ali is picked by his county is because of his batting, not his bowling. Without that, I wonder whether he would have a county at all. Regarding their relative merits as test bowlers, I'm mostly going by the impression that when Tredwell was dropped by England for the returning Ali, the team's spin bowling suffered.
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Old 3rd June 2015, 18:26   #103
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Fairly easy to see why they've been reluctant to pick Rashid.
Don't think Rashid's a specially good one day bowler though he may be a possibility for test cricket. Seems the England way to blood potential test players in ODI's.
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Old 3rd June 2015, 21:55   #104
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Originally Posted by oldandfat View Post
Really? How? Ali has struggled since coming back from injury but bowled well against the Indians. Tredwell isn't picked by his County.
I believe the reason that Tredwell is not in the ODI squad (I would have played him in every ODI over the last two years) is that the coach has asked for a team of really good fielders.
Isn't he good in the slips?
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Old 3rd June 2015, 22:02   #105
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I'll be interested to see what batting order they go with in the ODI series. It was clear during the World Cup that Jos Buttler was wasted at 7 and my personal preference would be for him to bat at 5...the position occupied by a hideously out of form Eoin Morgan.

They also need to find room for Stokes in the top six - again, I think he is ideally suited to number 5 but if Buttler moves to 6 then Stokes will need to come in at 4, with Joe Root coming in first drop.

From the squad selected I would probably go for (assuming Morgan has to play):

Hales
Roy
Root
Stokes
Morgan
Buttler
Willey
Rashid
Jordan
Wood
Finn
We all struggle to pick the batting line up because of morgan. He should not be above stokes or jos but won't bat six and stokes and jos won't go 3 and 4. We have a problem!
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Old 3rd June 2015, 22:25   #106
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We all struggle to pick the batting line up because of morgan. He should not be above stokes or jos but won't bat six and stokes and jos won't go 3 and 4. We have a problem!
Only if we insist on picking Morgan...
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Old 7th June 2015, 16:38   #107
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Originally Posted by square leg umpire View Post
Don't think Rashid's a specially good one day bowler though he may be a possibility for test cricket. Seems the England way to blood potential test players in ODI's.
It's unfair on Rashid having to prove himself in a format he doesn't excel in. It's like picking Cook or Anderson for the T20 side to see if they can cut it in Test cricket.
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Old 7th June 2015, 17:29   #108
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It's unfair on Rashid having to prove himself in a format he doesn't excel in. It's like picking Cook or Anderson for the T20 side to see if they can cut it in Test cricket.
If that's what they're doing. He's actually not nearly as bad in one-day cricket as you're implying. He took the most wickets of any English player in the One Day Cup last year. If Moeen Ali isn't going to play in preparation for the Ashes, and they've apparently ruled out Tredwell on age - there really isn't a superior spinner in the country.
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Old 7th June 2015, 20:22   #109
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If that's what they're doing. He's actually not nearly as bad in one-day cricket as you're implying. He took the most wickets of any English player in the One Day Cup last year. If Moeen Ali isn't going to play in preparation for the Ashes, and they've apparently ruled out Tredwell on age - there really isn't a superior spinner in the country.
Quite, there's a lot of fuss being made about Rashid being called up for the odi side.
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Old 7th June 2015, 23:02   #110
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If you want to assess whether Rashid has the mental toughness to be thrown into the Ashes cauldron, it is not unreasonable to look for him to rise to the challenge of the NZ one dayers. You know the Kiwis are going to go after him, but then so would Australia in a test match.
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Old 8th June 2015, 09:17   #111
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So, if he performs poorly, someone would have to decide (or guess) whether it was lack of mental toughness or simply the result of successful targeting. We would probably be no nearer to an answer.

As already said, though, the huge dissimilarities in the formats render each no rigorous test of ability for the other.
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Old 9th June 2015, 01:39   #112
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Why immediately assume the negative? It is an opportunity. If we are lining up excuses for him, and he for himself, he is beaten before he even starts. That he did not get a chance to play in the tests in WI suggests he did not convince at that time, in the nets and the tour games.

England could hardly bring him into the Ashes with no recent international experience.
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Old 9th June 2015, 06:43   #113
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I don't think the England selectors especially have players put in waiting slots for the Ashes in mind in terms of selecting the squad for the ODIs, although they would, no doubt, pay attention to good performances. The indirect effect in the squad has come from resting a proportion of previously first choice players so they can get red ball cricket and / or a bit of a rest before the proper stuff starts. Of course they may well have decided to move Anderson, Bell and perhaps even Broad on from ODI cricket altogether but Mo Ali will likely be a mainstay of the ODI team for years: he's been left out to get bowling rhythm in the county game.
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Old 9th June 2015, 07:04   #114
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Quite, FS. Moeen will start the Ashes.
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Old 9th June 2015, 08:06   #115
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I like rashid. The problem is that the cricket24/7 police dont see him as a specialist.
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Old 9th June 2015, 08:32   #116
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Originally Posted by D/L View Post
So, if he performs poorly, someone would have to decide (or guess) whether it was lack of mental toughness or simply the result of successful targeting. We would probably be no nearer to an answer.

As already said, though, the huge dissimilarities in the formats render each no rigorous test of ability for the other.
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Originally Posted by stevieh View Post
Why immediately assume the negative? It is an opportunity. If we are lining up excuses for him, and he for himself, he is beaten before he even starts. That he did not get a chance to play in the tests in WI suggests he did not convince at that time, in the nets and the tour games.

England could hardly bring him into the Ashes with no recent international experience.
There was no assumption of anything, just a pointing out of the difficulties there may be in any analysis of the cause of any poor figures.

I really hope Rashid does well.
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Old 9th June 2015, 12:48   #117
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...if he plays.
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Old 10th June 2015, 01:55   #118
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...if he plays.
He certainly did play! Grabbed his opportunity with both hands. Well done to him. He should be given an extended run in the ODI team and then who knows where that may take him. Great stuff.
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Old 10th June 2015, 09:08   #119
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Quite, FS. Moeen will start the Ashes.
Not sure that is as likely as it was yesterday morning.
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Old 10th June 2015, 09:53   #120
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He certainly did play! Grabbed his opportunity with both hands. Well done to him. He should be given an extended run in the ODI team and then who knows where that may take him. Great stuff.
Well, he'll certainly be selected for the 2nd ODI.

Very pleased for him, especially after the way he's been treated since first selection.

Not getting too carried away about his international one day credentials after just one match, though, and the opposition having to chase 400+ should raise all sorts of caveats.
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