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Old 15th January 2015, 13:33   #121
Sir Virgs and Zamora
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Indeed. He got an edge which the keeper dropped and slip caught. In the media this became "hit straight to first slip"
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Old 15th January 2015, 14:00   #122
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He probably just let his emotions run away with him a bit.

Personally, I lean towards Boxing Roo's opinion on the matter of sledging.
In fairness to Clarke, he has been injured and his captaincy taken over by Smith. It may take time to change old ways and habits. We don't necessarily want or expect Aussies and Indians to become like choirboys overnight.
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Old 16th January 2015, 12:48   #123
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That's not what i remember. There was a huge furore at the first test (some huge banner detailing "we know what you did last summer" for instance) which led to Broad entering the press conference with a newspaper tucked under his arm.
That's called a "wind up", having a bit of fun. You seem to be under the mistaken impression the Aussie supporters need to feel a genuine grievance to do that. Not so. The mere fact that he exists is enough.

You also seem to have selective memory. Bob Willis for instance (among others)..."Stuart Broad a cheat like his father"

It was the atrocious umpiring that most Aussie fans didn't like.

He didn't really get the stick in Aus that he would have had there been a contest. Once it was apparent what a one sided humiliation it was going to be (shortly after Midge got the ball) and that it wasn't possible to demorilize any England player further, they took it easy. Quite the respectful gesture.
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Old 16th January 2015, 12:58   #124
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Indeed. He got an edge which the keeper dropped and slip caught. In the media this became "hit straight to first slip"
It faintly nicked Haddins glove on it's way to slips, where it was always headed. It was almost a "late cut", more so than an edge. The only way it might have been more of a "howler", is if it sent middle stump cartwheeling. When next have your lenses checked, could you take Aleem Dar with you lol?


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Old 16th January 2015, 13:01   #125
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That's called a "wind up", having a bit of fun. You seem to be under the mistaken impression the Aussie supporters need to feel a genuine grievance to do that. Not so. The mere fact that he exists is enough.

You also seem to have selective memory. Bob Willis for instance (among others)..."Stuart Broad a cheat like his father"

It was the atrocious umpiring that most Aussie fans didn't like.

He didn't really get the stick in Aus that he would have had there been a contest. Once it was apparent what a one sided humiliation it was going to be (shortly after Midge got the ball) and that it wasn't possible to demorilize any England player further, they took it easy. Quite the respectful gesture.
Agreed, I thought that banner was pretty funny, the best the Aussies have come up with since the Phil Tufnell fielding academy stuff.
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Old 16th January 2015, 13:05   #126
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Originally Posted by thedon View Post
That's called a "wind up", having a bit of fun. You seem to be under the mistaken impression the Aussie supporters need to feel a genuine grievance to do that. Not so. The mere fact that he exists is enough.

You also seem to have selective memory. Bob Willis for instance (among others)..."Stuart Broad a cheat like his father"

It was the atrocious umpiring that most Aussie fans didn't like.

He didn't really get the stick in Aus that he would have had there been a contest. Once it was apparent what a one sided humiliation it was going to be (shortly after Midge got the ball) and that it wasn't possible to demorilize any England player further, they took it easy. Quite the respectful gesture.
I dont condone Broad's actions, just disagreed with the Australian whingeing about someone doing something that they have done for years.

So the conclusion is that cos England were rubbish it was a wind up but had they been decent it would have been full scale stick. The thing is, at that point of the first test (i.e the end of the first day) it wasnt apparent that England were rubbish as they had bowled well and Mitch had yet to have a bowl. So i think your categorising of it being a wind up if somewhat flawed!
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Old 16th January 2015, 13:23   #127
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I dont condone Broad's actions, just disagreed with the Australian whingeing about someone doing something that they have done for years.
I do condone Broads actions and have absolutely no problem with it. That's what Umpires are there for. You'll find that most Aussies will feel that way, yet it won't stop them getting stuck into him. In a very strange way that you might not understand, Broad has played a style of cricket for some time (including that incident), particularly against us, that has endeared him. That is likely to make him even more of a target for the "winder uppers".

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So the conclusion is that cos England were rubbish it was a wind up but had they been decent it would have been full scale stick.
No, it was always a wind up, period. There was little point giving him stick in the end. I think many might have even been feeling sorry for him as much as anything.

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The thing is, at that point of the first test (i.e the end of the first day) it wasnt apparent that England were rubbish as they had bowled well and Mitch had yet to have a bowl. So i think your categorising of it being a wind up if somewhat flawed!
Of course. You seem to have no concept of what a wind up is (ie. the very part of the post you are talking about lol).
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Old 16th January 2015, 13:39   #128
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In fairness to Clarke, he has been injured and his captaincy taken over by Smith. It may take time to change old ways and habits. We don't necessarily want or expect Aussies and Indians to become like choirboys overnight.
Like choirboys? As an ex-choirboy, I can assure you we weren't very different from Aussies and Indians.
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Old 16th January 2015, 13:42   #129
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I do condone Broads actions and have absolutely no problem with it. That's what Umpires are there for. You'll find that most Aussies will feel that way ...
I think that the advent of the DRS has largely made the notion in bold obsolete. In the brave new world the umpire is only there to make the decisions as long as the decisions he makes are correct. If he doesn't get it right, the players can overrule him. Of course, in this instance, which was rather exceptional, the reason why Broad was in a position to take advantage of the umpire's mistake, and decide not to overrule him by walking, was because the Aussies had no reviews left, which is perhaps their own fault. Nonetheless, it is a bit strange to appeal to the idea that the umpire is there to make the decision and everyone just has to live with it, because in modern international cricket that position is really only held by India (and then only by default, because of the intransigence of the other nations in respect of Hawkeye), and is widely abominated.
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Old 16th January 2015, 13:45   #130
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I do condone Broads actions and have absolutely no problem with it. That's what Umpires are there for. You'll find that most Aussies will feel that way, yet it won't stop them getting stuck into him. In a very strange way that you might not understand, Broad has played a style of cricket for some time (including that incident), particularly against us, that has endeared him. That is likely to make him even more of a target for the "winder uppers".


No, it was always a wind up, period. There was little point giving him stick in the end. I think many might have even been feeling sorry for him as much as anything.


Of course. You seem to have no concept of what a wind up is (ie. the very part of the post you are talking about lol).
Ah yes, just all a wind up. How foolish of me to think otherwise. Was the Warner-Root contretemps just a wind up as well?
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Old 16th January 2015, 14:16   #131
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I think that the advent of the DRS has largely made the notion in bold obsolete. In the brave new world the umpire is only there to make the decisions as long as the decisions he makes are correct. If he doesn't get it right, the players can overrule him. Of course, in this instance, which was rather exceptional, the reason why Broad was in a position to take advantage of the umpire's mistake, and decide not to overrule him by walking, was because the Aussies had no reviews left, which is perhaps their own fault. Nonetheless, it is a bit strange to appeal to the idea that the umpire is there to make the decision and everyone just has to live with it, because in modern international cricket that position is really only held by India (and then only by default, because of the intransigence of the other nations in respect of Hawkeye), and is widely abominated.
All fair enough points, but I'm probably a bit old fashioned. For those of us who have been following cricket long enough, DRS is a (relatively) recent thing.

As much as I like to wind Indian fans up about it, I don't think their stance is as frivolous or without merit as it's been made out. Though in the end I don't care that much either way, as long as both teams agree.

I haven't finished going through the links yet (partly) that you provided in another post, but there are some claims about it all that don't seem to be backed by much. I would still like to see where someone independent has tested hawkeye (and how they did it) to verify its claimed accuracy. The claims of it getting whatever % decisions right, compared to Umpire alone seems to rely on acceptance of it's accuracy to begin with (how do we really know this?).

There are a lot of optical effects involved, I wonder how the "algorithm" is worked out (is it different for the varied conditions etc?). There are instances where it simply looks wrong, as well as hotspot and snicko both appearing unreliable at times. This, apart from the rules around its implementation.

As you say, it was the Aussies fault they had no reviews left. Though if you are looking to implement a system to rid obvious mistakes, the reasons might be less important than the result. Which was quite a failure in this instance (and many others).

I heard an interesting discussion during today's match that "ORS" (Officiating Replay System) is going to be the way forward, which will remove all input from the players, other than the normal appealing for a decision and put it back completely with the Umpires.
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Old 16th January 2015, 14:22   #132
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Ah yes, just all a wind up. How foolish of me to think otherwise. Was the Warner-Root contretemps just a wind up as well?
Don't know (and really don't care), wasn't there.

Apparently Warner wasn't dropped for swinging one, he was dropped because after going to the trouble, he missed. Which is basically being dropped for poor form. You know I wouldn't wind you up Tongo.
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Old 16th January 2015, 14:28   #133
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... I would still like to see where someone independent has tested hawkeye (and how they did it) to verify its claimed accuracy ...
I'm told that this did actually happen, although I don't know the details, and those papers I linked to weren't really on that topic.

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I heard an interesting discussion during today's match that "ORS" (Officiating Replay System) is going to be the way forward, which will remove all input from the players, other than the normal appealing for a decision and put it back completely with the Umpires.
If the practical details (i.e., principally, the need for a swift intervention from the off-field umpires) can be worked out, I think that's probably a good idea, as it would certainly be nice to see the umpires get their functional infallibility back (and thus deserve their capital U), even at the price of becoming a borg.
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Old 16th January 2015, 19:03   #134
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Like choirboys? As an ex-choirboy, I can assure you we weren't very different from Aussies and Indians.
Haha. I know what you mean, SB. After all, Cook was himself a chorister of some renown. I also have "ex-choirboy" in my credits! Happy days.
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Old 7th July 2015, 22:27   #135
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A British Tamil league player has died while playing in Surrey after being struck by a ball.

We will presumably be told that this is another freak accident.
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Old 7th July 2015, 22:38   #136
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A British Tamil league player has died while playing in Surrey after being struck by a ball.

We will presumably be told that this is another freak accident.
He was hit on the chest. How is it not a freak accident?
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Old 7th July 2015, 22:56   #137
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He was hit on the chest. How is it not a freak accident?
Being hit by a meteorite while driving would be a freak accident. Being hit by a ball being thrown at you from 20 yards is surely not so, it happens a lot, even if the outcome today was tragic and very unfortunate. And it's not just me, FICA have classed serious injury from being hit by the ball as being a critical risk to players and umpires.
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Old 7th July 2015, 23:01   #138
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RIP Bavalan Pathmanathan
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Old 7th July 2015, 23:03   #139
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Being hit by a meteorite while driving would be a freak accident. Being hit by a ball being thrown at you from 20 yards is surely not so, it happens a lot, even if the outcome today was tragic and very unfortunate. And it's not just me, FICA have classed serious injury from being hit by the ball as being a critical risk to players and umpires.
You're way out on this imo. Players get hit all the time, it happens. These particular 'outcomes' are definitely freak accidents.

I played against fast bowling for a number of years & got hit many times. I'm currently not dead.
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Old 7th July 2015, 23:22   #140
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You're way out on this imo. Players get hit all the time, it happens. These particular 'outcomes' are definitely freak accidents.

I played against fast bowling for a number of years & got hit many times. I'm currently not dead.
No, but poor Bavalan Pathmanathan is, and Phil Hughes. Only fortune saved Stuart Broad from a career ending or life ending injury and Craig Kieswetter has had to hang up his gloves. I don't want to get into semantics about what constitutes freak or not but I think this is happening too much to sweep under the carpet. Does cricket have to wait until a major lawsuit to change?
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