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Old 16th May 2015, 12:29   #261
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Surprised no one is mentioning Luke Fletcher getting into the T20 side. A T20 specialist bowler who is well worth keeping an eye with a World Cup coming up.
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Old 16th May 2015, 13:17   #262
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Matthew Fisher (17) 3.2-0-22-5

According to reports bowling at 85mph so passing the basic entry of bowling for England. Selected for England U19s and even named in a Yorkshire squad at 15 in a 40 over match. One for the not too distant future we hope. Maybe when Anderson retires in a couple of years Fisher will take over. I would rather see someone young coming through instead of 29/30 year olds who get mentioned to play for England.

Yorkshire seem to have more young talent coming through than other counties and not worried about playing them.
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Old 16th May 2015, 14:01   #263
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Matthew Fisher (17) 3.2-0-22-5

According to reports bowling at 85mph so passing the basic entry of bowling for England. Selected for England U19s and even named in a Yorkshire squad at 15 in a 40 over match. One for the not too distant future we hope. Maybe when Anderson retires in a couple of years Fisher will take over. I would rather see someone young coming through instead of 29/30 year olds who get mentioned to play for England.

Yorkshire seem to have more young talent coming through than other counties and not worried about playing them.
Essex have two 17 year olds playing for them today.

Probably not in Fisher's class though.

One player thyough who made his debut as a 17 year old for Essex and is very much an England prospect is Reece Topley. His first over back was a bit of a nightmare as he faced Sangakkara and went for 27 runs, but he's bounced back well and dismissed the main man and gone for just 9 runs off his next 2.
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 16th May 2015, 14:13   #264
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Alex Hales' treatment by the England selectors with regards to the 50 over game has been a disgrace.

Stick him in there as opener, and give him 12 months worth of cricket before you even think about making an evaluation of how he's done. None of this hokey-cokey ******** they've put Hales through up to this point.
You can see why he wasn't in the side when out of county form, as it's probably rather unfair to give guys a go when they aren't confident in their games but that's no excuse for the in, out, shake it all about crap, no.
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Old 16th May 2015, 14:30   #265
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Essex have two 17 year olds playing for them today.

Probably not in Fisher's class though.

One player thyough who made his debut as a 17 year old for Essex and is very much an England prospect is Reece Topley. His first over back was a bit of a nightmare as he faced Sangakkara and went for 27 runs, but he's bounced back well and dismissed the main man and gone for just 9 runs off his next 2.
Can't believe I have missed half of this. Thought it would be on later. At least I can see how Essex go in their run chase. I imagine Topley will start in ODIs first. He gets lots of 5fers in the 4 day game, what I like to see when selecting bowlers for England.
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Old 17th May 2015, 17:16   #266
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Hales getting experience of sitting on an Indian bench watching the game as opposed to an England one.

Can only help the boy this.....
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Old 17th May 2015, 22:14   #267
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It was a poor innings by Bell with the bat.
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Old 17th May 2015, 22:57   #268
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Hales getting experience of sitting on an Indian bench watching the game as opposed to an England one.

Can only help the boy this.....
He gets to mix with genuine world superstars and learn his trade though YAMS. Today alone he mixed an energy drink for Partiv Patel and Keiron Pollard said "shot" when he hit a straight drive in the nets off Vinay Kumar.
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Old 17th May 2015, 23:26   #269
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Old 19th May 2015, 16:24   #270
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Hales' T20 education continues apace: today he got to peel a banana for Lendl Simmons and listen to Rohit Sharma crack a funny.
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Old 19th May 2015, 17:21   #271
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Hales' T20 education continues apace: today he got to peel a banana for Lendl Simmons and listen to Rohit Sharma crack a funny.
I think you have it all wrong. Hales is there to give guidance to the MI.

ICC 20/20
3 Hales
24 R Sharma
27 L Simmons
52 K Pollard
149 P Patel
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Old 19th May 2015, 18:42   #272
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Alex Hales' treatment by the England selectors with regards to the 50 over game has been a disgrace.

Stick him in there as opener, and give him 12 months worth of cricket before you even think about making an evaluation of how he's done. None of this hokey-cokey ******** they've put Hales through up to this point.
No evaluation of how he's done? Why would you need to do that if he's so good but merely thwarted in some way? (by decent bowling).

Hales has an average of 21 in 10 games. He'll be given another opportunity against New Zealand and Australia. If he bats well good luck to him! Until then his record is the weakest in the squad. He was also judged to be out of form in Australia. So how is his non selection "a disgrace"? When he did come in he was stuck in the crease. He hasn't even got one 50 in 10 games.

The Hales lobby thinks he has a divine right to a place in the side and can be carried for a year no matter if he gets a series of ducks. However you might be right. After all Morgan has been proclaimed as ODI captain by supremo Strauss after he got a series of ducks and couldn't put bat to ball. Why stop there? Let the whole team play without evaluation for a year. Ali is well on the way to the joining them with a string of low scores. It could be an anti-ODI side, with no stress at all about runs on the board - indeed why tally the runs at all?
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Old 19th May 2015, 19:08   #273
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No evaluation of how he's done? Why would you need to do that if he's so good but merely thwarted in some way? (by decent bowling).

Hales has an average of 21 in 10 games. He'll be given another opportunity against New Zealand and Australia. If he bats well good luck to him! Until then his record is the weakest in the squad. He was also judged to be out of form in Australia. So how is his non selection "a disgrace"? When he did come in he was stuck in the crease. He hasn't even got one 50 in 10 games.

The Hales lobby thinks he has a divine right to a place in the side and can be carried for a year no matter if he gets a series of ducks. However you might be right. After all Morgan has been proclaimed as ODI captain by supremo Strauss after he got a series of ducks and couldn't put bat to ball. Why stop there? Let the whole team play without evaluation for a year. Ali is well on the way to the joining them with a string of low scores. It could be an anti-ODI side, with no stress at all about runs on the board - indeed why tally the runs at all?
I'm sorry but that is a rather silly straw man. Hales has a successful domestic limited overs players, a top class World t20 record against many of the same quality one day bowlers (a t20 hundred v SL), he deserved a longer and more continuous run in the side than he got with the chance of at least bedding in with a continued stretch of matches ahead of the World Cup earlier this year.

What occurred instead was a lot of pussy footing around with the openers last year, all with the intent and purpose of protecting a woeful Cook. So what happened was a couple of games here and there for Hales and Bell (with the latter dropped last autumn and for some of the Sri Lankan games as well) with both often playing at no.3 where they either have no real track record of success or simply aren't used to playing there. 3 of his 9 innings were at no.3.

In those circumstances is it really that much of a surprise that Hales didn't do that well? He should have been given a real continuous go at opener last year when there was still time to experiment ahead of the world cup. He wasn't the only one to suffer a bit of damage. The bone-headed thinking of the management also resulted in the likes of Ben Stokes being batted further down the order than he should have been and thus him not developing his international game in the right way.

England really ought to give a real chance to whom they consider to be their real 'likely lads' going forward. Given the England schedule this year, there seems little point in flogging the senior test players, such as Bell, Anderson and Broad to death and heck even the likes of Buttler should be given the odd one dayer off, but that is partially another argument.
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Old 19th May 2015, 20:11   #274
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Lewis Gregory now has 19 wickets at 27 in champo this season.

Early for Craig Overton but 7 at 19 and 27 with bat.

Promising.
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Old 19th May 2015, 21:59   #275
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... England really ought to give a real chance to whom they consider to be their real 'likely lads' going forward ...
I suppose that's probably what they thought they were doing when for example they gave Ballance all those extra games when it very quickly seemed clear to many people that he was a dead man walking. Ditto Morgan. Ditto Cook. Alterego's point really is that if you just pick the people who you wish were good enough and leave them there, then you may well end up with a rubbish team because your guesses of who would be good weren't good enough guesses. In the end it's international cricket and you have to drop someone if they're not performing. If they're doing so-so and there are other people for that place then you can only give them a short while to prove themselves. As it turns out Hales will probably get another bite at the cherry but in that respect he's lucky that his chance hasn't gone. And incidentally the notion of a straw man has recently been rendered passe through massive overuse on these forums.
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Old 19th May 2015, 23:00   #276
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I suppose that's probably what they thought they were doing when for example they gave Ballance all those extra games when it very quickly seemed clear to many people that he was a dead man walking. Ditto Morgan. Ditto Cook. .
Ballance was a poor selectorial judgement in that he had barely played ODI cricket going into the world cup and even less one day experience at no.3. The other two had a far longer spell of not doing well prior to the world cup than what Hales was given in his favoured position when he hadn't played ODI cricket beforehand.

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Alterego's point really is that if you just pick the people who you wish were good enough and leave them there, then you may well end up with a rubbish team because your guesses of who would be good weren't good enough guesses. In the end it's international cricket and you have to drop someone if they're not performing. If they're doing so-so and there are other people for that place then you can only give them a short while to prove themselves.
Unfortunately England already had a rubbish ODI side before Hales even got a go, and as it goes there aren't really others from the world cup squad who who make a convincing case going forward.

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As it turns out Hales will probably get another bite at the cherry but in that respect he's lucky that his chance hasn't gone. And incidentally the notion of a straw man has recently been rendered passe through massive overuse on these forums.
As I said, he's had only 6 innings as an opener, a paltry number in ODIs, especially when he didn't even play them on the bounce. Oh and there's never enough of a use for a straw man, especially for Sir Virgs and MF.
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Old 20th May 2015, 06:55   #277
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Correct sans. People lose a discussion so say "blah blah blah straw man blah blah blah"
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Old 20th May 2015, 07:09   #278
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Correct sans. People lose a discussion so say "blah blah blah straw man blah blah blah"
No we are pointing out that YOU have lost a discussion or perhaps started an argument that you never wanted to win in the first place given the vacuousness of your discussion.
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Old 20th May 2015, 07:26   #279
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No we are pointing out that YOU have lost a discussion or perhaps started an argument that you never wanted to win in the first place given the vacuousness of your discussion.
That's quite enough straw men for one day.
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Old 20th May 2015, 08:15   #280
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That's quite enough straw men for one day.
You can never get enough of them!
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