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Old 5th May 2009, 12:56   #361
ChivaIsDead
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Samit's got to lose weight, the rights and wrongs of it are immaterial. I don't think you can really draw anything from his international performances to date when he's batted at 7 - I don't think he's made a single-figure score and has mostly got out playing reckless shots in pursuit of quick runs - in a format where he is generally weaker and can only really be perceived as an all-rounder, who should probably bat at 5 or 6 at this stage of his career. He's more a first-class option, I personally wouldn't select him for ODIs whatsoever until he shows marked improvement. As I was saying though, Samit's stance on the issue, our stance on the issue, are all irrelevant. The ECB have told him to lose weight/get fitter (there may be a difference?) and he has to do that, regardless of perceived injustices. If he doesn't do that then tough, he obviously doesn't want it enough.

Obviously, I personally would play him anyway in Twenty20s on the basis that he's one of the best all-round options. But you know what? I'm thinking tough if all he's going to do is whine about it. I'm sure he, more than anyone else, has the tools at his disposal to get fit quick. With Flintoff looking a bit doubtful he might still even have a slim hope of getting into the squad if he gets his head down now. I'll try and barrack him tomorrow...
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Old 5th May 2009, 13:24   #362
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Look what happened to Phil Taylor when he lost weight, his throwing went all to cock. Samson's strength was in his hair, Patel's is in his rotundness!!
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Old 5th May 2009, 14:04   #363
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The fitness tests are Level 12 on the bleep test, swim 50 lengths and run 6 miles. I guess they might be done on different days and not one after another.
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Old 5th May 2009, 14:21   #364
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The fitness tests are Level 12 on the bleep test, swim 50 lengths and run 6 miles. I guess they might be done on different days and not one after another.
The 6 miles must be far less of a grind than the 50 lengths. Not everyone can be that good a swimmer and that can't necessarily be that helpful to establishing fitness. How about the bleep tests with shuttle runs, that is more of a pain. I passed them with flying colours when I did them a while ago!
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Old 5th May 2009, 14:44   #365
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The 6 miles must be far less of a grind than the 50 lengths. Not everyone can be that good a swimmer and that can't necessarily be that helpful to establishing fitness. How about the bleep tests with shuttle runs, that is more of a pain. I passed them with flying colours when I did them a while ago!
I'd sooner swim than run - about 5 or 6km and I'm a wreck - but I could swim all day long. Still, I suspect that if I were trying to win an England place I'd head for another jog or two each week...
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Old 5th May 2009, 14:50   #366
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I'd sooner swim than run - about 5 or 6km and I'm a wreck - but I could swim all day long. Still, I suspect that if I were trying to win an England place I'd head for another jog or two each week...
Clearly Samit needs some temptation at the end of his run. Reminds me of a sledge once dished out by Ian Healy to Warne about Arjuna Ranatunga to get him to come down the track. "Put a mars bar on a good length. That should do it!" Perhaps a treat or two should be put down for him at the end of the course, with the caveat that it is attached to a fishing hook on a truck that will then drive off at a quick enough pace to keep away from him but a slow enough pace to keep him chasing after it. After the extra couple of miles it can come to a halt so that Samit doesn't consume the extra calories that the original run will have taken away.
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Old 5th May 2009, 15:02   #367
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If I was Samit I'd swim like hell cos of the danger of being harpooned.
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Old 5th May 2009, 15:03   #368
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If I was Samit I'd swim like hell cos of the danger of being harpooned.
Surely though Notts fans will then become members of the save the whale foundation.
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Old 5th May 2009, 15:04   #369
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It's a thought - and it speaks to a larger truth as well - something needs to motivate him to do it. You'd have thought it would be the prospect of playing for England, but if not, he's got to work out what. IPL money? What's it all about for him?

A final thing occurs to me - would you not be a bit embarrassed running these tests with your teammates and falling so far short of their standards? If my figures are worse than others in the team I'm always convinced I let the side down, even if we win - when the stakes are that much higher, why wouldn't Patel have been embarrassed by this the first time?
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Old 5th May 2009, 15:11   #370
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The 6 miles must be far less of a grind than the 50 lengths. Not everyone can be that good a swimmer and that can't necessarily be that helpful to establishing fitness. How about the bleep tests with shuttle runs, that is more of a pain. I passed them with flying colours when I did them a while ago!
I wonder if there is a time limit for the swimming and running or is it just being able to do it. I would say doing 50 laps of breastroke is not as taxing as running 6 miles.

What would happen if you couldn't swim at all. Would that ruin your chances of playing for England or would they give the person another kind of test?

Also if a player isn't fit then maybe doing the fitness training with England at a higher level than a player is used to can cause injuries.

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Old 5th May 2009, 15:11   #371
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The fitness tests are Level 12 on the bleep test, swim 50 lengths and run 6 miles. I guess they might be done on different days and not one after another.
Well if that's the case and Samit cannot complete these than the ECB are right in dropping him. It shouldn't come down to the size of the player, ok that does have some influence on performance and we'd all like 11 sportsman looking individuals playing than 11 dough boys, but as long as a player can fulfill the standard fitness tests they deserve to play.

Obviously Patel has been dropped for failing to reach these rather standard fitness criteria, not just because he looks a bit podgy.
It's down to him to get his fitness up so he can complete them, if this is the case and he still keeps failing them then it's all his fault.

It's quite common to find fat looking people who are in fact rather fit.
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Old 5th May 2009, 15:14   #372
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I wonder if there is a time limit for the swimming and running or is it just being able to do it. I would say doing 50 laps of breastroke is not as taxing as running 6 miles.
Depends on the person.
I'd sooner job 6 miles than do 50 laps. I used to do 50 laps every evening after work at the local pool and it killed me for every time for the first few months. It's bloody hard.
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Old 5th May 2009, 16:10   #373
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I wonder if there is a time limit for the swimming and running or is it just being able to do it. I would say doing 50 laps of breastroke is not as taxing as running 6 miles.

What would happen if you couldn't swim at all. Would that ruin your chances of playing for England or would they give the person another kind of test?

Also if a player isn't fit then maybe doing the fitness training with England at a higher level than a player is used to can cause injuries.
Theyd strap you to Samit's back and really give him a work out. Its not as if hes going to sink or anything is it?
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Old 5th May 2009, 16:43   #374
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Id just say **** it and go and play for Ireland instead.
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Old 5th May 2009, 20:37   #375
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Not a reliable measure. Try it for any international rugby union forward and see what results you get.

I'd be amazed if any come out below a BMI of 30, which allegedly counts as "morbidly obese", whereas in reality they are some of the fittest sports stars in the world......
True enough on the BMI point although a quick look at Samit Patel tells you he's no rugby union forward and actually, if he were, it would still be the wrong build for cricket. By the way, BMI > 30 is obese, > 35 morbidly obese.
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Old 5th May 2009, 20:44   #376
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If I was Samit I'd swim like hell cos of the danger of being harpooned.


If you put a Ginsters curry slice on the starting blocks at either end of the pool then Samit would do 500 lengths nevermind 50.
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Old 5th May 2009, 20:44   #377
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The fitness tests are Level 12 on the bleep test, swim 50 lengths and run 6 miles. I guess they might be done on different days and not one after another.
Doing them consecutively would be a much better test. For sure, cricket is about an awful lot more than fitness but frankly, I'd expect a professional sportsman to be at least plausibly close to being as fit as I am (which is moderately but by no means exceptionally fit). Being well, well behind that sort of standard is just weak. Given that Samit has been told to sort that problem out and doesn't seem to care enough to do so, I'm happy enough for England to cut him loose for a good while and give him the chance to grow up and shape up.
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Old 5th May 2009, 20:47   #378
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The fitness tests are Level 12 on the bleep test, swim 50 lengths and run 6 miles. I guess they might be done on different days and not one after another.
Weren't they just Glamorgan's?

They should be OK with the bleep tests and the run, reckon the swimming must be a killer though.
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Old 5th May 2009, 21:00   #379
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Weren't they just Glamorgan's?

They should be OK with the bleep tests and the run, reckon the swimming must be a killer though.
I thought Croft was talking about what was needed when he was with England.
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Old 5th May 2009, 22:38   #380
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I saw Patel on TV yesterday and I'll admit I was a bit shocked. He looks a couple of stone overweight at least; certainly in worse shape than when he last played for England. If that's the condition he's in 2-3 months after being dropped then I can understand why he hasn't been recalled for the T20 WC. It took Ian Blackwell a great number of years to sort himself out and by then it was too late. I hope the same fate doesn't befall Samit.
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