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Old 26th May 2007, 23:36   #141
Vaughansashes2009
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Well the swinging conditions ought to have suited him far better than Harmison, who is not a swing bowler. He bowled some very good balls, by the sounds of it but also loads of drosss. I suspect that Harmison was good enough to justify another game but of course there may not be a slot for him when Hoggard returns. It's a close decision.
Very close. But the fact is Plunkett bowled better so it would suggest he should be retained.

On a related front people are always saying Plunkett is a swing bowler. I dont think he is. He is a seam / fast bowler who also has the ability to swing it. In my mind this means he has far more potential than most other bowlers.
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Old 26th May 2007, 23:38   #142
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Very close. But the fact is Plunkett bowled better so it would suggest he should be retained.

On a related front people are always saying Plunkett is a swing bowler. I dont think he is. He is a seam / fast bowler who also has the ability to swing it. In my mind this means he has far more potential than most other bowlers.
I think that's all true. Plunkett is not a pure swing bowler by any stretch of the imagination. Still, he does swing the thing and doesn't get sharp bounce so this wicket should suit him better than Harmison. We have to suspect that not much at test level would suit Harmison at present though.
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Old 26th May 2007, 23:40   #143
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We have to suspect that not much at test level would suit Harmison at present though.
Then he should be sacked.
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Old 27th May 2007, 00:16   #144
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Then he should be sacked.
It's only a suspicion. I haven't nominated my preferred side for Old Trafford yet but I think he probably gets that one, for my money. I'm not at all sure anymore though. He got this test from the Fatslogger selection panel because the alternatives looked so unconvincing and even then it was a close run thing. The problem with him now is that if he can't come off excellent county form and play a test match and at least resemble a test bowler then how can we ever trust him again? He needs a proper run of success to restore faith in him and I don't dispute that he barely merits the chance to play more tests to establish that run. The odd performance here and there will not be adequate.
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Old 27th May 2007, 00:18   #145
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Sky were suggesting that Plunkett and Harmison need to play next week. Unfortunately Durham only have a one day game against Derbyshire on the Friday. However the MCC are playing against the West Indies at Durham Uni so they could play for them if Moores deemed they needed more practice.
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Old 27th May 2007, 00:24   #146
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Sky were suggesting that Plunkett and Harmison need to play next week. Unfortunately Durham only have a one day game against Derbyshire on the Friday. However the MCC are playing against the West Indies at Durham Uni so they could play for them if Moores deemed they needed more practice.
The thing is that Harmison had plenty of successful county cricket in the run in to the Lords test and still bowled gash. Plunkett only had the one CC game but did very well and of course had bowled in a few ODIs too. I'm not sure how much more bowling they need having just played in back to back tests. Harmison is a puzzle wrapped up in an enigma shrouded in mystery to me. I've no idea what will work best for him and I know that I'm not alone there. Plunkett probably should bowl some more. He's only a kid and needs the practice. If he grooves his action, he could be a really useful bowler.
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Old 27th May 2007, 01:41   #147
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I saw the highlights, and GBH did indeed bowl some corkers."
Here's the evidence. Tabloid headlines "SDC admits Harmison world class bowler".
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:04   #148
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The problem with him now is that if he can't come off excellent county form and play a test match and at least resemble a test bowler then how can we ever trust him again?
Then he should be sacked.

(Aidan: touché.)
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:08   #149
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We should play every test match at CLS and then he'd be fine.
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:20   #150
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I'm a big fan of Harmison but unless he starts showing some form then he will have to be sent back to Durham. Hopefully Donald's appointment will bring out the best in him. The same goes for Plunkett - albeit I don't think he quite has what it takes yet at international level. Perhaps a season for him like Mahmood, playing County Cricket. If England persist with four bowlers then I would like it to be Flintoff, Hoggard, Panesar and one other quick. Andy Cadick or Alan Richardson would get my vote
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:22   #151
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They showed the 2004 ICCCT final in the rain breaks today. Not a stunning performance from Harmison but everything looked a lot smoother and a lot more menacing.
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:28   #152
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I'm a big fan of Harmison but unless he starts showing some form then he will have to be sent back to Durham.
When? When? How many more last chances are we going to give him?

(William: still couldn't bowl the tail out, though, could he?)
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:33   #153
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When? When? How many more last chances are we going to give him?

(William: still couldn't bowl the tail out, though, could he?)
The second innings of this Test? Maybe once he gets his 200th Test wicket?
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:42   #154
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They showed the 2004 ICCCT final in the rain breaks today. Not a stunning performance from Harmison but everything looked a lot smoother and a lot more menacing.
Did you see that one delivery that came up at 95mph?

Ah.. the good old days when Flintoff actually carried a smile.
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:44   #155
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Maybe once he gets his 200th Test wicket?
I'm not waiting 'til he's 35...
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:46   #156
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Even I'm starting to lose patience with Harmison. I'll give him to the end of this series (assuming the selectors do as well) to get it right. If he can't then we'll have him back at Durham.
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:53   #157
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Even I'm starting to lose patience with Harmison. I'll give him to the end of this series (assuming the selectors do as well) to get it right. If he can't then we'll have him back at Durham.
Agree completely.
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Old 27th May 2007, 21:54   #158
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It'll be interesting to see how long the selectors do give Harmison. Hopefully the situation won't crop up, but it looks almost certain I'm sad to say.
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Old 27th May 2007, 22:01   #159
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Hi guys, first time poster and apollogies if this has been brought up earlier but if England were to drop SH for the remainder of this series he might realise that he doesn't have a God given right to be in the side which might prompt him into sorting out his problems, or attempting to. On the other hand however might it be worth seeing how he develops under Allan Donald, if that makes a difference. Or I could just be talking rubbish
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Old 27th May 2007, 22:04   #160
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Hi guys, first time poster and apollogies if this has been brought up earlier but if England were to drop SH for the remainder of this series he might realise that he doesn't have a God given right to be in the side which might prompt him into sorting out his problems, or attempting to. On the other hand however might it be worth seeing how he develops under Allan Donald, if that makes a difference. Or I could just be talking rubbish

Welcome to the board EE13.

TBH I don't think dropping him would do him any good. He'd just shrug his shoulders and say "I've had a good run".
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