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Old 29th May 2007, 15:49   #41
Vaughansashes2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris View Post
Unfortunately I agree with this. The amount of cricket needs to be cut, but its ridiculous tri-series in neutral venues and the Champions Trophy that need to be axed, not summer cricket.

If, as is the norm at the moment, 2 sides tour England each summer then 7 tests, 6 ODIs and a couple of 20/20s can be played against these, plus the odd ODI against Scotland, Holland or Ireland can also be played. Then you can have a couple of 3 test overseas tours each winter, with the 50 over and 20/20 world cups being played every 4 years.

Plenty of cricket and less burn out.

England is not the centre of the world you know.
All cricket is played in Summer, its just not summer here!
Just because you want other Countries to fit in with what we want does not mean they are wrong and we are right. Its not really the International cricket thats the issue is it anyway, it the rubbish pointless domestic one day competitions that is.
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:02   #42
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Originally Posted by englandsashes2009 View Post
England is not the centre of the world you know.
All cricket is played in Summer, its just not summer here!
Just because you want other Countries to fit in with what we want does not mean they are wrong and we are right. Its not really the International cricket thats the issue is it anyway, it the rubbish pointless domestic one day competitions that is.
Yes it is, have you never watched Harry Enfield?!

I'm talking from an English perspective, but if all countries adopted a similar schedule then there would still be loads of top class cricket played but less player burn out.

I agree that the Pro40 comp is cr*p and all domestic one day cricket should be 50 overs but the amount of international cricket is a massive issue. We would've probably been trounced in the Ashes anyway, but after the 2006 summer, the players needed 6 weeks off to relax and mentally prepare for the long winter ahead, not to fly halfway round the world to play in a pointless one day tournament, have a couple of weeks off then be undercooked for the Ashes. It affected our winter massively.
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:08   #43
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Yes it is, have you never watched Harry Enfield?!

I'm talking from an English perspective, but if all countries adopted a similar schedule then there would still be loads of top class cricket played but less player burn out.

I agree that the Pro40 comp is cr*p and all domestic one day cricket should be 50 overs but the amount of international cricket is a massive issue. We would've probably been trounced in the Ashes anyway, but after the 2006 summer, the players needed 6 weeks off to relax and mentally prepare for the long winter ahead, not to fly halfway round the world to play in a pointless one day tournament, have a couple of weeks off then be undercooked for the Ashes. It affected our winter massively.

I think the issue is the fact we are Northern Hemisphere and no one else is. Other players get long periods of time off when not touring England, even if they play alot at other times. Look at Australia before the CT. Our players dont get this.
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:19   #44
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I think the issue is the fact we are Northern Hemisphere and no one else is. Other players get long periods of time off when not touring England, even if they play alot at other times. Look at Australia before the CT. Our players dont get this.
Actually 6 of the 10 full member test nations are in the northern hemisphere, and although it's officially out of season there's still international cricket being played now. It's only England, New Zealand and South Africa that can't stage cricket all around the year, I just think that the NZ and Australia boards planned the schedule well for the world cup, and this showed in their results.

We could've easily looked ahead at the schedule and decided not to tour anwhere in early 2006 for example. Instead we went on a pretty gruelling tour of India with a stupid amount of ODIs, full well knowing we'd have pretty much non-stop cricket for the next 18 months with no time for breaks, etc.
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:23   #45
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Scrap Pro40 and replace with a straight 50 over K/o competition between 16 counties - the 2 that miss out would be the ones who finish in the bottom 2 in Div 2 of the CC the previous year. That would give those teams near the bottom of that division something to fight for. Also for the rest they may only play one game - the more games they play the more prize money so that in theory more competitive, especially if there is a sponsor who can shell out some decent money.
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:43   #46
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Originally Posted by chris View Post
Actually 6 of the 10 full member test nations are in the northern hemisphere, and although it's officially out of season there's still international cricket being played now. It's only England, New Zealand and South Africa that can't stage cricket all around the year, I just think that the NZ and Australia boards planned the schedule well for the world cup, and this showed in their results.

We could've easily looked ahead at the schedule and decided not to tour anwhere in early 2006 for example. Instead we went on a pretty gruelling tour of India with a stupid amount of ODIs, full well knowing we'd have pretty much non-stop cricket for the next 18 months with no time for breaks, etc.
Not proper NH IMO.
When would we have toured India then? The ODIs is a good point, but cut it back to 3 and we would have saved 8 days, thats all.

NB Aus and NZ didnt plan well IMO. Would you accept no International Cricket for 6 months (Aus) or hardly any tests for a year (NZ)?
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:54   #47
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Not proper NH IMO.
When would we have toured India then? The ODIs is a good point, but cut it back to 3 and we would have saved 8 days, thats all.

NB Aus and NZ didnt plan well IMO. Would you accept no International Cricket for 6 months (Aus) or hardly any tests for a year (NZ)?
We're going to India next autumn so was the series necessary?

I think perhaps NZ went a bit far, but at least it was forward thinking by their board to give them the maximum chance to win the big tournament of the year. I would however take no international cricket for 6 months if the result of it was the winter that Australia have just had.

Don't get me wrong, I love watching all cricket, but if breaks in schedules lead to the quality and intensity of cricket that Australia have recently produced, then it's very much a case of less is more to me.
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Old 29th May 2007, 16:57   #48
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We're going to India next autumn so was the series necessary?

I think perhaps NZ went a bit far, but at least it was forward thinking by their board to give them the maximum chance to win the big tournament of the year. I would however take no international cricket for 6 months if the result of it was the winter that Australia have just had.

Don't get me wrong, I love watching all cricket, but if breaks in schedules lead to the quality and intensity of cricket that Australia have recently produced, then it's very much a case of less is more to me.
I personally think 14 tests and 14 ODIs in a calender year is acceptable.
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Old 29th May 2007, 17:11   #49
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Originally Posted by englandsashes2009 View Post
I personally think 14 tests and 14 ODIs in a calender year is acceptable.
I don't mind 14 tests and up to 20 ODIs in a non world cup year. However from May 2006 to October 2007 our schedule is/was:

Domestic Summer
Champions Trophy in India
Ashes + CB series in Australia
World Cup in West Indies
Domestic Summer
20/20 World Cup in South Africa
ODI tour in Sri Lanka

In this time we've hardly had any time off to rest and mentally prepare for a tough list of matches, which is why I think the tour of India last year was unnecessary.

The scheduling over the next 12 months isn't too bad, however 2008-09 sees 14 tests and 23 ODIs scheduled in 10 months before taking into account the Champions Trophy. In all there's only 5 weeks off in that time (one block of 2weeks, one block of 3). It will lead to burn out and a lower standard of cricket.
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Old 29th May 2007, 17:11   #50
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The report is Complete and utter Tosh

Squad roatation systems or less 4 day / 50 over cricket and more T20 is the answer
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Old 29th May 2007, 19:26   #51
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I don't mind 14 tests and up to 20 ODIs in a non world cup year. However from May 2006 to October 2007 our schedule is/was:

Domestic Summer
Champions Trophy in India
Ashes + CB series in Australia
World Cup in West Indies
Domestic Summer
20/20 World Cup in South Africa
ODI tour in Sri Lanka

In this time we've hardly had any time off to rest and mentally prepare for a tough list of matches, which is why I think the tour of India last year was unnecessary.

The scheduling over the next 12 months isn't too bad, however 2008-09 sees 14 tests and 23 ODIs scheduled in 10 months before taking into account the Champions Trophy. In all there's only 5 weeks off in that time (one block of 2weeks, one block of 3). It will lead to burn out and a lower standard of cricket.
Sorted.

Seriously I envisage this:

Summer:

4 tests
5 ODIs (triangle, 2 against each and final)
1 20T
1 20T
4 tests

OR

6 tests
3 ODIs
2 20Ts


Winter:

3 tests
3 ODIs
1 20T
3 tests
3 ODIs
1 20T

OR

5 tests
3 ODIs
1 20T

Fit in WC and 20T WC scheduling a 3 test 3 ODI 1 20T winter before (ie tour one Country) or shorten our Summer to 4 Tests 3 ODIs 1 20T depending on where it is.

Results in a typical year in 14 tests, 11 ODIs and 4 20T.

Should be able to fit in R and R and even play a few games for Counties. I just dont get why there is a break between tests now and Plunkett and GBH for example cant even play a FC match for Durham....where is the planning?
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Old 29th May 2007, 19:52   #52
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I personally think the ICC need to ensure that the Champions Trophy and World Cup are not held within six months of each other. That is a total nonsense.
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Old 29th May 2007, 19:55   #53
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That calendar looks pretty good to me.

I don't see any reason why Harmy can't go back to Durham for a week, he's not involved in ODIs anymore so he hasn't had the busy winter/spring other players have had and it's not as if these tests have been tough physically or mentally like the Ashes a couple of years back. Fast bowlers have put the feet up for a couple of days before chucking the ball down and waiting for the innevitable poor shot for a day. Plunkett's only young too so should be itching to play as much cricket as he can.


And in response to cabinboy I think the ICC need to ensure the Champions Trophy is never held again, it is a total waste of time in an already congested calendar.
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Old 29th May 2007, 20:21   #54
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[quote=chris;51510]That calendar looks pretty good to me.

I don't see any reason why Harmy can't go back to Durham for a week, he's not involved in ODIs anymore so he hasn't had the busy winter/spring other players have had and it's not as if these tests have been tough physically or mentally like the Ashes a couple of years back. Fast bowlers have put the feet up for a couple of days before chucking the ball down and waiting for the innevitable poor shot for a day. Plunkett's only young too so should be itching to play as much cricket as he can.


And in response to cabinboy I think the ICC need to ensure the Champions Trophy is never held again, it is a total waste of time in an already congested calendar.[/QUOTE]

Too right, is it too much to hope that common sense prevails?
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Old 29th May 2007, 20:31   #55
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If thy do take out one test imagine the political in-fighting in the future considering there are now 3 new Test grounds - Riverside, Cardiff, Rose Bowl alongside Lords,Oval, Headingley, OT, TB, Edgbaston. 9 grounds fighting for 6 tests (bearing in mind Lords will get 2).

Good luck Mr Morgan.
Indeed. It would ride roughshod over the business plans of several counties. That, and the proposed reduction in county cricket could well put a few of them out of business. It won't just be political fighting - it'll be fighting for survival. However I don't think we need worry too much because it'll be in the hands of the domestic review panel (aka the county chairman) to make the final decision...

By the way - did anyone else get really mad with the way the report - or maybe the reporting of the report - assumes that the raison d'etre of the county game is simply to provide fodder for team England?
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Old 29th May 2007, 20:40   #56
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Indeed. It would ride roughshod over the business plans of several counties. That, and the proposed reduction in county cricket could well put a few of them out of business. It won't just be political fighting - it'll be fighting for survival. However I don't think we need worry too much because it'll be in the hands of the domestic review panel (aka the county chairman) to make the final decision...

By the way - did anyone else get really mad with the way the report - or maybe the reporting of the report - assumes that the raison d'etre of the county game is simply to provide fodder for team England?
Why would it put them out of business? Cant they survive on the millions they get from Sky and England?

Frankly if a few do go out of business what exactly will be the problem?
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Old 29th May 2007, 20:41   #57
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[quote=vaughan's #1 fan;51531]Indeed. It would ride roughshod over the business plans of several counties. That, and the proposed reduction in county cricket could well put a few of them out of business. It won't just be political fighting - it'll be fighting for survival. However I don't think we need worry too much because it'll be in the hands of the domestic review panel (aka the county chairman) to make the final decision...

By the way - did anyone else get really mad with the way the report - or maybe the reporting of the report - assumes that the raison d'etre of the county game is simply to provide fodder for team England?[/QUOTE]

The Counties cannot justify their existance and huge cost any other way. No County makes a profit without England money. End of story.
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Old 29th May 2007, 20:46   #58
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And in response to cabinboy I think the ICC need to ensure the Champions Trophy is never held again, it is a total waste of time in an already congested calendar.
I can buy that, it's a forgettable trophy any which way you look at it.
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Old 29th May 2007, 20:48   #59
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I can buy that, it's a forgettable trophy any which way you look at it.
Except for the ICC and the bean counters.
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Old 29th May 2007, 21:13   #60
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Why would it put them out of business? Cant they survive on the millions they get from Sky and England?

Frankly if a few do go out of business what exactly will be the problem?
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The Counties cannot justify their existance and huge cost any other way. No County makes a profit without England money. End of story.
I suspect you don't follow county cricket to have said those things. How do you think thousands of Surrey, Yorks, Glamorgan etc etc fans would feel if their team was no longer there to follow? If there was no local cricket for them to go and watch.

And in terms of youth development - how far do you think talented kids would have to travel to get proper coaching if there were even bigger geographical gaps in the county system than there are now.

The counties do not 'get millions' from anyone - we're not talking about the Premier League here you know. I wish they did, because then the county game would be stronger and the people running the counties wouldn't have to be distracted by commercial considerations which often are not the best thing for the game, but nevertheless have to be done to pay salaries, prepare pitches, invest in youth cricket.

A vibrant county system is essential for cricket to exist. Maybe in some ways the county chairmen weild too much power, but they are the vital link between grass roots and elite in this country - as well as popular sporting clubs with dedicated followings in their own right.
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