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Old 17th April 2017, 08:40   #2601
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Stokes had a very good game with the ball, at last.
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Old 17th April 2017, 10:10   #2602
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Stokes had a very good game with the ball, at last.
Not caught much of this IPL live (still more than any previous editions) so can't really compare with previous games but he did bowl nicely although I'd be terribly cautious about judging how well a guy has bowled from his T20 figures. I don't think he was quite as good in previous games but it's such a random format and there's such a big contribution from the state of the match even before you consider how small a sample size 24 balls is.
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Old 17th April 2017, 13:38   #2603
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Started off watching all the games with England players, then only with matches with England bowlers and now just the scorecard. My favourite team is Delhi Daredevils because Khan, Cummings, Pant, Morris and think Khan is the best captain.

What is Mathews in the team for? Neesham was far better.
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Old 17th April 2017, 14:09   #2604
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It was laughable. They batted a slogger who occasionally comes off in Smith at opener ahead of Roy, who's one of the best limited overs openers in world cricket then they batted Raina, a middle order man who played a horrible innings; Ishan Kishan, who was even worse and is a kid and Karthik, who did play well, to be fair, ahead of him too. Think they utterly deserved to lose after that and duly did. They've over committed to foreign batsmen who are top 4 guys, especially when Raina seems to like to bat at 3 too but this was terrible cricket in conception and execution.

I may have lost quite a lot of money on this game.
I think you're being a tad bit unfair on Gujarat- they were behind the 8-ball the moment they lost the toss. It was actually pretty hard to bat on in the day so much so that McCullum deemed that they had scored 15 runs over par. It visibly got much easier to bat on in the evening.

As for Roy, I didn't understand his signing in the first place. Don't get me wrong- Jason Roy is very much good enough to play the IPL but Gujarat just doesn't need another opener- they had three really good ones already in the team. They could have done a lot more with say Faulkner in the team.
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Old 17th April 2017, 14:41   #2605
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I think you're being a tad bit unfair on Gujarat- they were behind the 8-ball the moment they lost the toss. It was actually pretty hard to bat on in the day so much so that McCullum deemed that they had scored 15 runs over par. It visibly got much easier to bat on in the evening.

As for Roy, I didn't understand his signing in the first place. Don't get me wrong- Jason Roy is very much good enough to play the IPL but Gujarat just doesn't need another opener- they had three really good ones already in the team. They could have done a lot more with say Faulkner in the team.
They dropped one opener cos his kit hadnt turned up. Roy was the obvious replacement to open in the absence of Finch.
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Old 17th April 2017, 14:52   #2606
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They dropped one opener cos his kit hadnt turned up. Roy was the obvious replacement to open in the absence of Finch.
I know of the kit thing- but Roy wasn't the obvious replacement mostly because Finch has opened ZERO innings in four so far in the tournament. The two people who did open had a 94 run opening partnership in the previous match... so, in terms of who they wanted to open with, I think they were well justified.
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Old 17th April 2017, 14:53   #2607
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They dropped one opener cos his kit hadnt turned up. Roy was the obvious replacement to open in the absence of Finch.
You have to earn it. Smith has been a long-serving IPL pinch-hitting opener. Roy messed up his chance and the dropped catch may see him dropped from the team again.
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Old 17th April 2017, 15:17   #2608
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I know of the kit thing- but Roy wasn't the obvious replacement mostly because Finch has opened ZERO innings in four so far in the tournament. The two people who did open had a 94 run opening partnership in the previous match... so, in terms of who they wanted to open with, I think they were well justified.
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You have to earn it. Smith has been a long-serving IPL pinch-hitting opener. Roy messed up his chance and the dropped catch may see him dropped from the team again.
Have paid hardly any attention to the ipl to be honest but its hard to ignore when a player doesnt play cos his kit hasnt turned up! Would that have happened if kohli's kit hadnt arrived?
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Old 17th April 2017, 16:56   #2609
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I think you're being a tad bit unfair on Gujarat- they were behind the 8-ball the moment they lost the toss. It was actually pretty hard to bat on in the day so much so that McCullum deemed that they had scored 15 runs over par. It visibly got much easier to bat on in the evening.

As for Roy, I didn't understand his signing in the first place. Don't get me wrong- Jason Roy is very much good enough to play the IPL but Gujarat just doesn't need another opener- they had three really good ones already in the team. They could have done a lot more with say Faulkner in the team.
Don't think there was anything unfair in my analysis: you seem to agree that they've got their overseas players wrong, which they clearly have but that was no reason to bat an effective upper order guy down at 6, where he was wasted.
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Old 17th April 2017, 16:59   #2610
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You have to earn it. Smith has been a long-serving IPL pinch-hitting opener. Roy messed up his chance and the dropped catch may see him dropped from the team again.
Yes but long serving isn't actually the same as good. Smith's a pretty indifferent player by any standards, let alone overseas pro standards and him having had one of his occasional good innings the previous game doesn't change that. Anyway though, that wasn't really my problem with their batting order as bringing Raina, who's more effective in the middle overs and less effective in the powerplay in ahead of Roy, who's the reverse, made no sense but then Kishan before Roy too was just stark staring madness.
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Old 17th April 2017, 17:33   #2611
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Don't think there was anything unfair in my analysis: you seem to agree that they've got their overseas players wrong, which they clearly have but that was no reason to bat an effective upper order guy down at 6, where he was wasted.
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Yes but long serving isn't actually the same as good. Smith's a pretty indifferent player by any standards, let alone overseas pro standards and him having had one of his occasional good innings the previous game doesn't change that. Anyway though, that wasn't really my problem with their batting order as bringing Raina, who's more effective in the middle overs and less effective in the powerplay in ahead of Roy, who's the reverse, made no sense but then Kishan before Roy too was just stark staring madness.
I obviously agree with the basic point you make. Couple of points where I disagree with you are-

1. Smith has an Average of 30 at a strike rate of 134 in all IPL. At least, as far as this competion is concerned, you aren't giving him the credit he deserves- it is a rather impressive record. Especially, he has strung together a very good partnership with McCullum and has given teams blistering starts across franchises- they did it for CSK 2 years back... and did it for Gujarat in the oppurtunities they had last year. And already did that this year too, in the previous match. Breaking them up would have been foolish especially when they didn't have the best of starts to the tournament and had much to worry about in other areas to tinker with something that actually works for them.

2. Jason Roy should not have been selected in the team once they decided he wasn't opening- Suresh Raina, again, has been batting at 3 with great success for the last 10 years in the IPL. So the earliest Roy would have been expected to come in was 4. And from there they probably wanted to throw the bowlers off by pursuing the left hand-right hand combination.

So, it wasn't the fact that he came at 6 that was the problem, according to me. It was the fact that he was selected.
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Old 17th April 2017, 17:47   #2612
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I obviously agree with the basic point you make. Couple of points where I disagree with you are-

1. Smith has an Average of 30 at a strike rate of 134 in all IPL. At least, as far as this competion is concerned, you aren't giving him the credit he deserves- it is a rather impressive record. Especially, he has strung together a very good partnership with McCullum and has given teams blistering starts across franchises- they did it for CSK 2 years back... and did it for Gujarat in the oppurtunities they had last year. And already did that this year too, in the previous match. Breaking them up would have been foolish especially when they didn't have the best of starts to the tournament and had much to worry about in other areas to tinker with something that actually works for them.

2. Jason Roy should not have been selected in the team once they decided he wasn't opening- Suresh Raina, again, has been batting at 3 with great success for the last 10 years in the IPL. So the earliest Roy would have been expected to come in was 4. And from there they probably wanted to throw the bowlers off by pursuing the left hand-right hand combination.

So, it wasn't the fact that he came at 6 that was the problem, according to me. It was the fact that he was selected.
You're clearly right that if you're going to play Roy at all, batting him at 6 is stupid, especially when you had the option of using him effectively as an opener as there was an early wicket and you still eschewed it, so yes, should in that case have gone for an overseas bowler, although not sure they've got a decent one - Faulkner is a bit of a low rent all rounder for my money so you can play him ahead of Roy but then do you also play an Indian batsman ahead of an Indian bowler?

I don't entirely dispute what you say about Smith's record as opener although his overall T20 stats are somewhat worse than that and Roy has both a better average and a much better strike rate (144) in the format (and even if you compare Roy's overall stats to Smith's IPL ones still a much better SR) so I don't really think it's that difficult to pick between them, myself but then that's not really the bit I think they've been absurd about. If you're playing Roy though, as a guy everyone knows is an opener, batting Raina ahead of him when there's a wicket in the first over is just obviously wrong. Raina is more effective in terms of runs per ball outside the powerplay, Roy less effective, with a game based around hitting the ball over the infield for 4 so, hence you're getting less out of both players. Even those decisions pale into nothing by comparison with batting Ishan Kishan, even if he is a prospect, ahead of Roy though.
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Old 17th April 2017, 18:05   #2613
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You're clearly right that if you're going to play Roy at all, batting him at 6 is stupid, especially when you had the option of using him effectively as an opener as there was an early wicket and you still eschewed it, so yes, should in that case have gone for an overseas bowler, although not sure they've got a decent one - Faulkner is a bit of a low rent all rounder for my money so you can play him ahead of Roy but then do you also play an Indian batsman ahead of an Indian bowler?
As I said in my very first post, Roy is more than good enough to succeed in the IPL. He just should much rather have been in Mumbai (who open with Buttler!) or Kolkata (who have opened with Narine and de Grandhomme) to have more chances.

As for Faulkner, they could do with an all rounder- they did seem a bowler short in the end and Faulkner looks more than capable of tonking a few coming in at 6 which is what Roy ended up doing.
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Old 17th April 2017, 22:23   #2614
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Not caught much of this IPL live (still more than any previous editions) so can't really compare with previous games but he did bowl nicely although I'd be terribly cautious about judging how well a guy has bowled from his T20 figures. I don't think he was quite as good in previous games but it's such a random format and there's such a big contribution from the state of the match even before you consider how small a sample size 24 balls is.
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Started off watching all the games with England players, then only with matches with England bowlers and now just the scorecard. My favourite team is Delhi Daredevils because Khan, Cummings, Pant, Morris and think Khan is the best captain.

What is Mathews in the team for? Neesham was far better.
It's not really that surprising that English cricket fans aren't that excited about the IPL. It is, after all, a foreign league, so hard to be that engaged beyond the English players getting a game or one of the big stars doing something amazing.

And the timings mean I rarely catch more than a bit of a game now and then.
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Old 18th April 2017, 07:55   #2615
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As I said in my very first post, Roy is more than good enough to succeed in the IPL. He just should much rather have been in Mumbai (who open with Buttler!) or Kolkata (who have opened with Narine and de Grandhomme) to have more chances.

As for Faulkner, they could do with an all rounder- they did seem a bowler short in the end and Faulkner looks more than capable of tonking a few coming in at 6 which is what Roy ended up doing.
Agree that the Lions have ended up with a laughably unbalanced squad, which isn't good for whichever of their openers end up down the order.

Interestingly, Faulkner doesn't actually hit the ropes effectively at all in T20, he's far more of a turn the strike over kind of guy, facing very few dot balls but taking nearly 10 balls to hit the ropes. He's an anti Chris Gayle with the bat.
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Old 18th April 2017, 12:57   #2616
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Agree that the Lions have ended up with a laughably unbalanced squad, which isn't good for whichever of their openers end up down the order.

Interestingly, Faulkner doesn't actually hit the ropes effectively at all in T20, he's far more of a turn the strike over kind of guy, facing very few dot balls but taking nearly 10 balls to hit the ropes. He's an anti Chris Gayle with the bat.
Part of the reason they had an unbalanced first team though was because Dwayne Bravo was injured...and he's reportedly back and probably walks into the first team.
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Old 19th April 2017, 11:44   #2617
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Mills injured.. wonder what is wrong with him.

Vettori hopeful that de Villiers, Badree and Mills will be fit for their next game on the 23rd.


Mills
During that match I unfortunately tweaked my hamstring while bowling and even though I was able to finish the game, it ruled me out of the next couple against Pune and Gujarat which is extremely frustrating. It's not a bad injury, however so I won't be out for long.

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Old 20th April 2017, 18:31   #2618
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Buttler should not be opening the batting. Maybe at 3 or 4. Same with Billings.
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Old 20th April 2017, 23:22   #2619
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Have you seen Kings XI bowling. I Sharma hasn't taken a wicket yet econ 9.70. M Sharma average 50.50 econ 9.39 etc etc. The only decent bowler is Axar Patel. Bowling must be the worst in the IPL.

Can't believe that Varon Aaron has been left out for the useless Ishant. His T20 average for India 50.00.
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Old 21st April 2017, 01:03   #2620
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Have you seen Kings XI bowling. I Sharma hasn't taken a wicket yet econ 9.70. M Sharma average 50.50 econ 9.39 etc etc. The only decent bowler is Axar Patel. Bowling must be the worst in the IPL.

Can't believe that Varon Aaron has been left out for the useless Ishant. His T20 average for India 50.00.
Both are equally useless- I can't believe they traded off Shardul Thakur only to then panic buy Ishant.
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